Righting an H18 solo with a Murray's Big Bag
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- Rank: Master Chief
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Posted: Jul 10, 2017 - 11:42 AM
Not a bad idea
I had stopper knots in my last 2 bags
did not help at all when they both fell off my boat and sank post a real rough capsize and mast stuck in the muck (i couldn't figure out for the life of me why i couldn't right the boat - then my friend pulled up on his cat, and walked over to my mast in the shallows) -
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Posted: Jul 11, 2017 - 09:47 AM
I tie my Colorado Bag Company bag to the boat (from the bottom of the bag with a decent length of 1/4" line) so when the boat comes up and I unclip the bag (now full of water and acting like a sea anchor) from my righting line and then it will drag behind my boat (empty, rather than acting like a sea anchor) and I can pull it back in and stow it easily.
I can right my Nacra 5.8 solo and i'm 180lbs. (i just did it twice this last week for the first time ever, so even a complete noob can do it).
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1987 Nacra 5.8
1978 Isotope (sold)
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Posted: Jul 11, 2017 - 11:01 PM
There are two similar strings going here tonight on these righting bags.
I added a chunk of closed cell foam to the tackle line next to the stopper knot. I don't think it will get in the way and not so big a chunk that it will interfere with the use of the line. Hopefully the chunk is big enough to float the metal bits in the rig high enough to give me a chance to retrieve everything as it floats away or starts to sink.
I don't see any "easy" way to do a line from the bottom of the bag. I for sure don't want to pierce the bag.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jul 12, 2017 - 12:29 AM
I'm not sure why there is even a discussion on losing your righting bag, & attempting to solve a problem that shouldn't exist in the first place. Your righting bag is secured to the righting line, no?
If it isn't, do it, & forget about foam/floats etc.
Go back to page 1 of this thread & look at my setup. In the photo, the left side of the purchase attaches to the righting line with a short piece of Spyderline.
Flip your boat on it's side,(in the water), toss the righting line over the hull & determine where the bag needs to be attached to the righting line. Tie a knot at that spot,(to prevent the bag slipping down), then attach the bag just above the knot. You only need 3:1, & I found it better to rig it as shown so that you pull upwards to raise the bag & cleat
Now stuff everything inside the bag, roll it up into a small package, & secure to the tramp. I tie it near the front beam onto a hiking strap.
Next time you find yourself lying on your side, undo the bag, shake the line out, & toss it over the hull. You might have to scrunch the bag up to effectively toss it.
GPS shows righting the 5.0, & being underway in 3 minutes, with no worry about dropping 8 losing the dammed bag.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: Jul 12, 2017 - 01:35 AM
Ed,
Maybe you sail solo exclusively, so permanent attachment of a bag to the righting line would make sense. But if you are sailing double handed the bag would only be in the way for righting and completely unneeded on the boat, so for those of us that do not want the bag in the way all the time a small degree of added protection that doesn't interfere with the operation seems to make sense. I did look at your setup it is quite substantial and expensive, not to mention heavier than needed. All that is required is the 3 to 1 block or similar, tieing the line off is simple enough without needing a rarely used cleat, if the bag is full at 10 gallons it is about 83 lbs., holding off 1/3 of that weight is about 28 lbs. and that is not that hard to do the once in a blue moon you need to use the bag and tie it off.
The floating away thing is actually a joke. I am quite certain that I can easily manage clipping the bag on the righting line without losing it, literally or figuratively.
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dg
NACRA 5.2 #400
This End Up
Original owner since 1975
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Posted: Jul 12, 2017 - 02:04 AM
Well, each to his own, but really, you have to stow the righting line anyway. The line takes up much more space than the bag. Stuffing the line into the bag solves stowing it. On the uncluttered tramp of the 5.7, I've never found it gets in the way, even with 3 or 4 people on the boat. Ditto with the H18. Tie it near the front beam, nobody sits there anyway.
The purchase & bag weigh about 2lb, so I don't worry about the extra weight.
I do find the purchase/cleat essential. We've messed around seeing how long we can keep it on one hull, loser supplies beer. That means you tend to keep it further over than ideal sailing dictates, & we do go swimming. At 170lb, if the wind is light, I need quite a bit of the bag filled, certainly more than 28lb,(my buddy is 28lb heavier than me, & he can't solo right the 5,0 unless the wind is about 20)
For the couple of ounces the cleat weighs, it just makes life simple to hoist the bag, then get yourself into position, & hike. Especially if it's near the end of a long day & I'm getting tired.
You are correct in probably not needing it when crewed, but my lake is 450 sq miles, & quite a lot of it is barren of any traffic, especially after Sept 1 long weekend. End of Sept, & Oct we can sail without seeing anything else on the lake.
I always sail with the assumption my crew will not be able to assist with righting, or I may be partially disabled. I did break an ankle a couple of years ago when we flipped the 20' Mystere.
In my mind the few ounces of a cleat is cheap insurance as rescue may not be imminent.
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Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
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Posted: Jul 12, 2017 - 08:11 AM
not a joke at all: i lost 2 bags that sank in cold water - i wasn't going diving/digging for them after the fact (the fact was it was a bad capsize, that left my mast unknowingly stuck in shallows, i was exahsted from this and i had a local police boat on top of me, asking me all sorts of questions as my gear sank)
I also know first hand of very experienced sailors losing a bag during righting, as there are many things going on at the same time often
Never know - you may have damage to something that is changing the dynamics - i have seen masts fill with water stopping a boat from being righted by 2 people -
Edited by MN3 on Jul 12, 2017 - 08:12 AM.
