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My second catamaran  Bottom

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  • Battens are in. Most of my batten ends are 3D printed.
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=134969&g2_serialNumber=3

    I discovered that the seal for the mast is under the halyard pulley. Hopefully that seal is good. Do they go bad? Should I yank the pulley off and re-seal that part?

    This sail has been repaired. Several batten pockets have been restitched. This was done by a professional sail maker. After seeing the workmanship, I have no concerns about my own sewing work.

    In the prior post I said our first trip would be on the weekend. I meant to say weekday. Less rental kayaks to mow down.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • The plugs can go bad and the boat is very old. One way to tell is to remove mast, submerge it, look for bubbles, and listen for water sloshing around in there. If you capsize and the mast takes on water, the boat may be a bear to right.

    Maybe put that on your off-season to-do list if nothing else.

    FYI.....there should be another plug a foot or so up from the mast base, and all fittings/rivets on the mast should be sealed.

    --
    Jerome Vaughan
    Hobie 16
    Clinton, Mississippi
    --
  • Thanks Jerome, we will put that on our off-season list. Probably would be a good time to update the mast hound as it's a little busy up there with 3 stays and 4 trap wires on one hole. We had to use another couple of shackles for the trap wires.

    Also thanks for that vertex. My gooseneck looks good now. Question, is the boom pin supposed to pull out this far?
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=134996&g2_serialNumber=3

    Our swivel was bent, so I took it off and straightened it. Seemed hard to cleat the traveler with it so low to the tramp.
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=134997&g2_serialNumber=3

    Some practice on the trapeze:
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=134998&g2_serialNumber=3

    Here are some questions I posted over on the Hobie forums, but I'll repeat here in case any beachcats members know the answers but are not on the hobie forum:

    1) Shroud tension - how tight should they be? They have to be a little loose for us to be able to connect the forestay. Then when we crank the jib halyard tight, we can still push the mast side to side a little bit. If I move both adjusters 1 hole tighter I can make that go away, but we would need to loosen them up for stepping and dropping the mast.

    2) Rudder cam tension - we had a broken cam and replaced them both. The guys over at the beachcats forum let me know I had to grease the cams, which I did last night. When down and locked, it seems easy to push on the bottom of the rudders and get them to unlock. We have the delrin screw in as tight as it will go. Is this normal/OK? I am worried the drag on the rudders will pop them back but I don't have the experience to know.

    3) Mast stepping - when raising the mast, the ball on the bottom of the mast seems to go forward of the socket. We always need two people, one to push the bottom of the mast aft to get it to drop into the mast base. Are we doing something wrong?

    4) Mast base - the hole for the stepping hinge is cracked. Not all the way through, but I think I'll want to replace it sometime. Do I need to replace the mast base and step as a pair? Or would a new base be compatible with my old step? I don't want to change the rake if I don't have to. It seems that I'd need new shrouds and also it sounds like the 5:1 mainsheet is not optimal for a more raked mast. Hard to justify a $400 6:1 on a $400 boat/trailer.

    5) Jib Halyard - it seems to bind at the top. Is there something to look for or am I just not used to how it tensions up? Hard to see what is going on with the little pulley when it is up that high.

    6) We have one trap harness and for the life of me I can't figure out how to wear my PFD and the harness at the same time.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • So how scary is this crack in the hole for the step hinge?
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=135146&g2_serialNumber=3

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • Boom pin: Yes, it's longer than necessary, but the boom will slide all the way forward when installed and outhaul set.

    Main traveler cleat: Someone probably stepped on it during mast raising. Can bend it back up with a couple of vice grips or such without removing it.

    Shroud tension: First, set shrouds for desired mast rake. Then jib halyard tension is a matter of preference/opinion. I generally run mine pretty dang tight (mast still needs to freely rotate) except when wind is real light. You're running the jib halyard around the cheek block and up through the fiddle block to get 3:1 purchase, right. Even when the rig is very tight, the leeward shroud will seem loose once sails are loaded up.

    Cam tension: Sounds about right.....doesn't take a whole lot of tension to hold rudder down. I can easily move my cams with my thumb.

    Mast raising: Not uncommon with ill-fitting hinges......you're not doing anything wrong. The Hobie mast hinge has a shoulder on it that catches on the sides of the hinge slot during mast raising. At first, the hinge rotates on the bottom pin. Once the shoulder catches, the mast rotates on the upper pin and the ball goes right in the cup.

    Mast base: That looks like a potentially bad accident waiting to happen. I've heard differing stories on compatibility of old/new base/step......would talk to a dealer or ask Mmiller on the Hobie forums about it. Will be a big expense and a lot of work regardless. I'd just look for a good used old-style base.

    Jib halyard: See above regarding 3:1 purchase. Also, the hole in the sheave in the center of the fiddle block is probably elongated. If so, it may stop spinning once loaded a bit.

    Put on harness then PFD. Helps to have a high-waisted PFD like kayakers use.

    I don't think you can call it a $400 boat anymore...maybe 400 man-hour! It's about time to sail the crap out of it and see what breaks. If something minor, then good for you. If it's a hull, then be glad you didn't pour any more time or cash into it! icon_smile



    Edited by rattlenhum on Jun 27, 2021 - 09:07 AM.

    --
    Jerome Vaughan
    Hobie 16
    Clinton, Mississippi
    --
  • Thanks Jerome for the answers. Quick report: just got back from the first sail. All went well. Video to follow.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • First time out. Not the most awesome sailing on YouTube but a big deal for us.
    https://youtu.be/GOX88EIhWDw

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • rattlenhum
    Shroud tension: First, set shrouds for desired mast rake. Then jib halyard tension is a matter of preference/opinion. I generally run mine pretty dang tight (mast still needs to freely rotate) except when wind is real light. You're running the jib halyard around the cheek block and up through the fiddle block to get 3:1 purchase, right. Even when the rig is very tight, the leeward shroud will seem loose once sails are loaded up.

    Jib halyard: See above regarding 3:1 purchase. Also, the hole in the sheave in the center of the fiddle block is probably elongated. If so, it may stop spinning once loaded a bit.

    We don't really know what our desired mast rake is. But it seemed good out on the water, so we will leave the shrouds 3 up from the bottom for now. It did tighten up nicely at that setting and we are using the 3:1 with the new cheek block we riveted on. It seemed ok overall, but I'll check the jib halyard pulley.

    rattlenhumCam tension: Sounds about right.....doesn't take a whole lot of tension to hold rudder down. I can easily move my cams with my thumb.

    The rudders were good. Didn't pop up until we pulled into the shallows.

    rattlenhum
    I don't think you can call it a $400 boat anymore...maybe 400 man-hour! It's about time to sail the crap out of it and see what breaks. If something minor, then good for you. If it's a hull, then be glad you didn't pour any more time or cash into it! icon_smile

    Definitely not a $400 boat anymore. I'll total up the total expenditures when I get a chance. Definitely good to have the start of sailing the crap out of it behind us!

    After a couple hours of sailing, we had about 2 quarts of water in each hull. Is that a lot? I'll do the shop vac exhaust/soapy water trick and look for the leaks.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • Excellent! Were those humpback whale calls I heard in the background? We had two good sailing days on our local lake this weekend, too (unusual for summer).....but no humpbacks.

    Maximum rake will be determined by your mainsail condition (stretch) and mainsheet system's stack height. You want to be able to sheet in hard but not quite go block to block. With the 5:1 and an old main, you'll probably be powered up pretty good still and not want to rake any further forward than that.

    When you do the bubble test, be sure to check the deck lip/seam where the decks are glued to the hulls. A bead of silicone will do that trick, or...even better...you can flip the boat and do a bead of thin epoxy. Other likely leak spots are the gudgeons and drain plug housings. (Proceed with caution on gudgeon screws....they may be seized with corrosion between SS screw and Al backing plate. Use Lanacote, anti-seize, or such when replacing.) When I've acquired older boats, I just skipped the bubble test and resealed all this easy stuff. If badly worn, the hull bottoms can leak as well. Also the foam plugs inside the pylons can leak. (There are small vent tubes in the forward ones, so bubbling there is normal.) If you capsize and the lower hull takes on a lot of water, those plugs are likely the culprit, but I wouldn't take the boat apart for the amount of water you're getting now. Less time working on boat equals more time sailing on Humpback Lake!

    --
    Jerome Vaughan
    Hobie 16
    Clinton, Mississippi
    --
  • I think the humpback call was the starboard rudder. Maybe I need a couple of bushings?

    We did have all the gudgeons and drain plug housings out. We resealed them when we put them back in.

    I'm not sure I know where the foam plugs are. We did have the stern of the boat buried a bunch of times in light wind. Probably makes sense to silicone the seam as you say and save a major rebuild for later.

    Thanks for the help!

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • FAQ on rudder hum/whale noise: https://www.hobie.com/sup…om/support/tech/hum.html

    Pics of pylon plug and other hull guts: https://www.thebeachcats.…47c461159ced83de963a2bb1



    Edited by rattlenhum on Jun 29, 2021 - 08:48 AM.

    --
    Jerome Vaughan
    Hobie 16
    Clinton, Mississippi
    --
  • Thanks Jerome! My starboard rudder has trailing edge damage. I'll sand that out first and see what happens.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • We got the whole family out. I took out my wife and younger son, while my oldest went solo in the Snark Sunflower.
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=135162&g2_serialNumber=3

    Three people is too much, need to get the SC17 going for the second boat. We buried a hull once and came to a stop. Low winds so no real drama, but a good learning experience.

    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=135163&g2_serialNumber=3

    After a bit my wife and I took the Snark, and the boys tooled around on the Hobie Cat. We did the swap on the lake.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • Our latest video:
    https://youtu.be/3Mew_e3mBMI

    Nothing too exciting. Winds were low. Good family fun though.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • I hooked up the shop vac exhaust to the drain plug. Warning, if you have a big shop vac it can be too much. The hull made some alarming noises and I turned it off. I ended up drilling four 3/8" holes in my shop vac adapter tube that I had made, to reduce the pressure getting into the hull. Here is some video of one of the pylon leaks:
    https://youtu.be/nSVUYlWflG8

    Hopefully I didn't destroy anything too badly. Also there were a bunch of old patches on the boat. Looks like they may have been done with plumber's putty. They all leaked. I sanded them out and glassed them over.
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=135170&g2_serialNumber=4

    We may sail tomorrow afternoon, and definitely Monday. I'm hopeful there will be less water in the hulls this time.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • I often see the suggestion to use a ship vac to leak test. In my opinion, that is clumsy, you need power cords, an extra hand to hold it, & it’s bloody noisy.
    Go to your local Dollarama, buy a balloon pump & make yourself a test rig.
    Here’s what I did, years ago.
    https://www.thebeachcats.…ictures?g2_itemId=118697

    --
    Hobie 18 Magnum
    Dart 15
    Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
    Nacra 5.7
    Nacra 5.0
    Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
    Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
    --
  • Edchris177,
    That's a great solution. I had drilled a hole in an old drain plug and done a hands-free adaptation to the shop vac. I had a small piece of rope to hand the shop vac hose from and required no help. Still noisy and able to overpressurize the hull. I think my adapter and a balloon pump would be ideal.

    Yesterday my son flew the hull on the H16 for the first time:
    https://youtu.be/nwSUO2dAS-Q

    Suddenly, this $400 boat has become the best investment I've made in a long time. Two brothers, 18 months apart, having fun together and not trying to kill each other. Plus my younger kid is an introvert with a weird sleep schedule and it's hard to get him out of the house.

    We still had some water in the hull after the patches and sealing, but it was a lot better.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • I have good news! My mast seems watertight. It floats nicely.

    Ok, good news out of the way. I pitch poled. That bad noise I was worried about when I pressurized the hull - I think it was really bad after all. The port hull snapped up front from where the noises came from.

    We got a tow in as close to the launch as we could, took off all the stuff, flipped the boat right side up so we could paddle it back to the launch. We tried righting it out in the lake but the hull was so heavy from the water I don't think we had a chance.

    Video to follow.

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • My kid is still processing the GoPro video. But I've got this:
    https://youtu.be/VJ3GRi3LqNU

    --
    Bryan in Poplar Grove, IL
    Supercat 17, unknown year
    Hobie 16, 1977
    --
  • waiex191I have good news! My mast seems watertight. It floats nicely.

    Ok, good news out of the way. I pitch poled. That bad noise I was worried about when I pressurized the hull - I think it was really bad after all. The port hull snapped up front from where the noises came from.

    We got a tow in as close to the launch as we could, took off all the stuff, flipped the boat right side up so we could paddle it back to the launch. We tried righting it out in the lake but the hull was so heavy from the water I don't
    think we had a chance.
    Video to follow.

    Damn, that’s ugly to watch. Dont beat yourself up, your overpresururization via the shop vac might have only been the final straw. It seems that deck was weak to begin with.(soft decks probably).
    I would not even try to add glass Matt to that hull. Remove it, chop it up, & burn it, (they do burn nicely once lit).
    Old H16’s are cheap. Look for a parts boat, (there are many that come up for less than you will spend trying to resurrect that hull, even though I know you have skills, & technical help) & use the required hull to make what’s known as a Frankenboat, or use both hulls for a match.
    The H16 has more hulls than almost all other Cats combined, BUT, they are an old design, & very prone to pitchpole. Most H16 sailors, if they could, would position themselves 3’ BEHIND the rear beam. If you could lay hands on a Nacra 5.0, or it’s bigger brother, the 5.7, you find you can drive it till the front beam is underwater, spray shooting in your face, & it will recover. Despite some friends really ham fisting my 5,7, in 5’ seas, we have only managed to PP it once.
    Anyway, I enjoy your posts. You have the skills & tools to fab up many parts, & you don’t seem to give damn about looks or bling, & that my friend, is a good thing.
    As written by Kenneth Grahame, in the kids classic, Wind in the Willows, “Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.”

    --
    Hobie 18 Magnum
    Dart 15
    Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
    Nacra 5.7
    Nacra 5.0
    Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
    Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
    --

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