The annoying questions begin - (Nacra 5.2)
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Posted: Jul 08, 2009 - 03:55 PM
I do run a barber hauler. In heavy winds it can be quite usefull downwind. I could live with out it but it didnt cost a whole lot to add it on the boat. I am going to start rigging my mast rotation very soon. I am copying the system off of the I17R/Nacra18 and putting the same setup on the 5.2. This will allow me to adjust the rotation from the wire and will increase the purchase immensly. I will take some pics of my boat and post them for you to see. You may get an idea from them or it may look like every other 5.2 out there.....It doesnt look like the rest. My front decks were glassed in after strengthening was done inside the hulls. I have smooth hulls in front of the crossbar now with no deck at all.....Smooth. -
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Posted: Jul 08, 2009 - 04:14 PM
Here's a pic i had on hand of the smooth front decks
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Posted: Jul 08, 2009 - 05:24 PM
Hey everyone,
I'm also interested in any pics of 5.2's especially upgrades/mods/improvements. Even stock photo's are great to figure out how to set it up properly, the old manual leaves a bit to be desired. Some of that is due to the poor resolution of the copy on Performance Cat's website.
Dave
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 12:28 AM
Here's a simple and cheap thing to help the rudders...Increase the purchase for around $10-15. Two blocks and some line. This really helped me pull the rudders nice and tight. I have since added balls to the ends. I tried t handle but the leeward would flap around too much.
If you have to replace your pivmatic's buy the ones with the metal cleat or retrofit. -
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 12:35 AM
heres my pieced together barber hauler system.
Nothing special here..Pretty standard. -
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 12:52 AM
There are two types of diamond wire systems on the 5.2. One is a single bar that goes through the mast with little adjustability. The second system is pictured. Im told the system pictured is stronger and more adjustable. I dont know this to be fact but i have noticed alot of the newer boats use this system rather than the single bar?
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 01:02 AM
These cleats are there to aid the bungee system. When the boat is beached or being moved on the wheels i place the line in the cleat and all the strain is taken off the bungee. If your bungee isnt 100% and you push the boat backwards up the beach and the rudder drops....SNAP. The bungee goes through the hole in the rudder...I have a small piece of line tied through the same hole, Its maybe two feet long. Changing the bungee is a pain so this is can help it last longer. If you dont want any spring assist from the bungee use airbornes system with the extra cleat on the bar.
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 01:22 AM
Notice the eyestrap on the left of the beam. I have a loop tied in a piece of line...I feed the non looped end through the eyestrap on the left and then a few feet later i have a stopper ball. I have this on both sides with a piece of bungee tied to the stopper balls. When not in use the bungee pulls the line in and out of the way. This is a chicken line that holds me to the boat when sailing solo under spin. You can put one of those cam cleats on the harness end of the rope and have it adjustable. I use a small stainless caribineer on the loop. Jump out on the wire and then clip the caribeener onto the trap line or harness. The rope then pulls out through the eyestrap and when im fully extended the stopper ball hits the eyestrap and limits my movement on the wire...This is great for rough sea conditions. I always carry a knife so i can cut away in an emergency.
I dont actually use a caribeener...I use the thing that looks like a caribeener that has the threaded lock assembly. Forgot what the proper term is? I leave it in the open position and use it like a hook. You dont want to be locked in incase of emergency or accidental gybe. If sailing solo under spin you can leave the clasp/caribeener thing hooked onto the wire so you have one less thing to deal with.
I will probably have to post the pic tomorrow of the actual system so you can really understand what im saying.
Basically before you hop on the wire -
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 01:34 AM
erice nailed the info on tacking...Be sure to get as much speed as possible and ease the sheet going into and through it. If your running a jib and are having trouble tacking in the beginning backwind the jib. Get as much speed as possible, start the tack, release a fair amount of main sheet, continue turning, Now you go through irons and hear the jib fillup with air. The jib is still sheeted on the wrong side at this point. Once the jib fills up on the wrong side and your through the irons sheet to the proper side and slowy sheet in main as you build speed. This is not ideal for speed but it works when your new to sailing and trying to figure out weight placement on the 5.2.
I will post up rigging photos tomorrow if i get off work early enough. I could always make a video and throw it up on youtube. Ill try to answer any questions with pics but i can make avideo too. Video will take a week or so though.
edited by: TurboCat, Jul 09, 2009 - 06:38 AM -
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 02:06 AM
Great info. I love the glassed over decks. I have a 1982 N5.2 with the old style mast...I wish I knew how to convert it to swept spreaders or had a way to replace it.
I'd love to see any more pics you've got. The 5.2 is new to me (been sailing a P18 for the last couple years) and it was fairly neglected for years before I found it, so I've been trying to update an fix everything I can.
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Rob
OKC
Pile of Nacra parts..
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Posted: Jul 09, 2009 - 02:44 AM
i always have problems finding this as it's in the technical gallery and i expect to find it in the downloads
it is downloadable pdf file of the nacra manual about 1985
it is earlier than the one on the nacra site which seems to be about 89-91
http://www.thebeachcats.com/performance/Nacra-printed-1985a.pdf
the 5.2 was made from 1975-1987-??? which were pretty much the glory days of beachcats and it went through quite a few changes before it was eventually replaced by the lighter/longer/wider/more sail area, nacra5.5
(the 5.5 being lighter than the 5.2 meant that nacra sold it in 2 versions. 1 for solo use without a jib and the other with a jib for crewed use)
one of the major changes over the 5.2's production life was the mast spreaders going from straight to swept
straight spreaders meant diamond wires, which allowed control of the mast's sideways bend characteristics. mast bend control in conjunction with mast rotation control was at the time considered an important tuning option. BUT rotating the mast to anything less than the ideal aerodynamic position seems to have cancelled out any benefit achieved by controlling the jib slot size
so when in the early 80's the tornado guys discovered that by raking the spreaders and really cranking on the downhaul they could bend the mast backwards and depower the sail more efficiently than releasing mainsheet straight spreaders were history
pretty soon all the cat makers changed from straight spreaders to swept spreaders and redesigned their sails to cope with the huge downhaul forces required
so if you have a straight spreader 5.2 ignore all the books that say to depower the sail by hauling on downhaul. the stock downhaul system won't give enough pull and the stick sail won't cope with 15 to 1 systems
edited by: erice, Jul 09, 2009 - 03:31 AM -
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Posted: Jul 12, 2009 - 10:03 PM
Hey Turbocat, thanks for the picks! I just came back from one of my first decent sails on the 5.2 in 13 knot winds. The boat performed beautifully!
I did notice that the eyese holding my barberhauler pulleys were pulling out of the hulls however. It looks like the guy that installed them just rivetted them to the hull without any backing plate or anything (argh). I'm just going to move them to the front beam like on your boat. Looks like I get to learn a bit about epoxy and gelcoat now.
Erice, thanks for the info on the downhauls. I was wondering about the stock sail handling that much tension. Good to know before I wasted a pile of money on something that wouldn't help me.
Anyway I also managed to dump the boat and right it using the righting rope thrown over the top hull. Wow did it come up easy compared to a Hobie 16. One thing I did notice though was that there was a fair amount of give in the bottom hull as I walked along it. No cracks or anything, the hull just distorted a bit where I stepped and bounced back when I stepped off. Is this normal or should I be concerned?
Regards,
Dave
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 02:17 AM
the hulls on the 5.2 have a lot more surface area than the h16 but have to weight about the same to be competitive with a h16, so they are pretty thin. esp. early boats with out the foam core
walking on them after a capsize does feel a little freaky however they seem tough enough
DON'T, however make blasting up onto the beach hobie style your normal beaching procedure or the hulls will eventual crack up
hobies have very thick bases and a strong triangular profile as they were designed for this, nacras and supercats etc were not
but those big round hulls support weight better than the vee hull on the h16
video from sunday with 3 adults and 2 children on a 5.2 in very little wind and no jib. probably 230kg, 500lbs and clipping along fast enough that the lubbers were happy. i suspect a h16 would have been a bit of a pig with that weight, though you would have been able to keep the jib on
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZ0WhsOR0Ds
early 5.2's had free floating universals? between the rudder cross-bar and the pintles. like all universals there is a position where they can bind and refuse to steer the boat. eventually nacra welded the parts together at a fixed angle. these can be bought from murrays...............or........you can simply lockwire the halves of the universals into the correct position with lockwire. experiment with string if you have to, there is very little loading and all you are trying to do is stop them rotating around to the binding position -
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 11:19 AM
Yeah, mines a 1981 so it is just fibreglass, no foam.
I definitely can't be blasting into shore where I am. I sail in the canadian shield area and it's only about 10 feet of sand and then you run into granite. :)
The hulls seem to be a lot more stable than the 16s too.
Not sure what you are referring to as far as free floating universals. I have a very similar system to what TurboCat shows on his pics above. Except the outboard pulley is rivetted to the hull. Or maybe I am misunderstanding or you are answering someone elses question.
On a related note, has anyone put a 'wear strip' on the bottom of thier hulls? I notices I have already scraped some of the new gelcoat of of the hull bottoms and was thinking that might be a good preventative measure for the future.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 11:26 AM
Yes, this is done regularly, especially for boats that do alot of beach landings. There is a California sailor that did "wear strip" in carbon. Not really needed unless you have a free supply of carbon, otherwise glass would work fine.
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Philip
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 12:37 PM
RE: On a related note, has anyone put a 'wear strip' on the bottom of thier hulls?.
I use Marinetex. 3-4 inch thin strip applied with a taping knife along the entire hull length and sanded smooth. (I just recently learned you can smooth it wearing surgical gloves and dish soap if you want to avoid the sanding.
Stuff wears like iron and the sand contact will further smooth it. I touch it up every spring. My solution elicits shock and horror from Nacra racers but it was a matter of preserving the bottom against the baby head rocks, pebbles and course glacial sand of Lake Mi. (Works great on daggers and rudders too!)
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 12:55 PM
Thanks for that advice! I think I will have to get some marinetex for the fall. Does anyone have pics of applying this stuff? Is it a fairly easy process?
Does anyone else have comments on the boinginess of the hulls when walking on them after a capsize? Or keeping rivets from pulling out of the hulls?
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 01:28 PM
Easy to do. Because it is catalyzed you can smooth it with a gloved finger and dish soap. (Might be the way to go because it is a beast to sand.) You mix it and you have about 15 minutes to apply it with a putty or taping knife. Also you clean the area with rubbing alchohol or benzine. The instructions are pretty explicit. Best if you could leave your cat upside down for a couple of days to cure.
Unless you walk the hulls with metal spikes in your sailing boots you can't hurt them. They are however very very vulnerable to sharp rocks and sharp objects.
My 91 5.8na has foamcore construction and no flex.
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 01:33 PM
PS: Nacra's were not made for use in surf conditions. I generally do not go out if we have breakers on the beach. (a: its really tough to manage the 5.8 in surf; b: I don't want to hit the beach at surf velocity.) I have gotten really good at dumping power regardless of wind and kissing up to the shore. -
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Posted: Jul 13, 2009 - 01:54 PM
we surf launch every weekend and havent had any problems. I dont think hobies get out through the surf and back any better than nacra's ?
I power down, travel out, uncleat the main, and turn up into the wind right before i hit the beach and roll it in on my cattrax. Beach launching takes a little practice but is alot more fun to me than the other options. Nothing wrong with a little excitement! Here in TX our waves are petty small. gt300.com has some great beach launch photo's!
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