• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Nov 30, 2010 - 12:22 PM

  Hi Everyone,
  
  Yesterday I came accross a Nacra 18m2 up for sale in my hometown, Amsterdam.
  Never heard of a 18m2 Nacra so I browsed the web only to find it has 5.5 hulls,
  lenght is 5.5 mtr (18 feet) beam is a stunning 3.25 mtr (10.7 feet) !! and it has
  a main only.
  I sailed my p 18-2 solo till late fall, and topspeed always was 19 knts, whatever I
  tweaked , couldn't get it any faster and I want to go faster. I have the impression
  the p 18-2 has a somewhat outdated hulldesign.
  Will I be able to right the Nacra solo considering the beam?
  I am a big guy 6.4 ft and 280 pnds but still .......
  Pricing is very tempting, so has anyone sailed a Nacra 18m2 ?
  Any information about the 18m2 is welcome.
  
  Greetings, André
  
  
  
  Edited by catmodding on Nov 30, 2010 - 10:26 AM.
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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• smfinley
  
  

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  Posted: Nov 30, 2010 - 03:46 PM

  I believe the 18m2 was designed to be a single handed race boat. Never sailed one, but I bet with your size you could right solo with a little effort, practice and a few tricks.
  
  --
  Scott,
  ‘92 H18 w/SX wings
  ‘95 Hobie Funseeker 12 (Holder 12)
  ‘96/‘01/‘14 Hobie Waves
  --

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• erice
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 01, 2010 - 02:48 AM

  my nacra 5.2 carries 19.6m2 of sail if you add jib to main
  
  an 18square is going to have a taller mast with a more efficient sail but it is probably going to have less sail area than your prindle
  
  the extra width is going to give your weight more righting moment which should help make up for the shorter hulls but you still might not get past 19knots, you might need more sail and length for that, something like a nacra 5.8 should do it
  
  the extra width will also make the boat a little slower in light air as the windward hull will be more "sticky"
  
  imho the 18m2 class is dead for a reason...

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• halfcat
  
  

  • Rank: Lubber
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  • Posts: 15

  Posted: Dec 01, 2010 - 12:31 PM

  The 18sm is fast with a new main (square top, Elliot/Patterson) and well rigged. Takes some practice to get to top of potential. usually out sails a F18 upwind but is slower downwind. If you add a spinnaker (Nacra sells a kit or you can add one yourself -F18 kit would work) it's faster downwind too. If you seal the mast you should not ever have a problem righting the boat yourself. Some of the older boats have stress cracks and need to be reinforced from time to time but can be competitive if sailed well. Portsmouth #'s are wrong since there are not a lot of them, shouldn't give time(without spinnaker) to an a-cat since it's a heavier boat even given the SA delta.

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 01, 2010 - 08:08 PM

  Thank you guys for the replies,
  
  First of all, it's an original , it carries the 18m2 sign in its main. Comes with a extra wide cat-track.
  
  
  

  erice

  my nacra 5.2 carries 19.6m2 of sail if you add jib to main
  
  an 18square is going to have a taller mast with a more efficient sail but it is probably going to have less sail area than your prindle
  
  the extra width is going to give your weight more righting moment which should help make up for the shorter hulls but you still might not get past 19knots, you might need more sail and length for that, something like a nacra 5.8 should do it
  
  the extra width will also make the boat a little slower in light air as the windward hull will be more "sticky"
  
  imho the 18m2 class is dead for a reason...

  
  @ Erice
  it has the longer mast and original mainsail, hulls are 5.5 . My p18-2 has more sail-area but can't break the 20 knt barrier.
  Catmodding is my hobby, so I was wondering to add a selftacking jib and a spinnaker on it.
  Extra width means more sail up and trimmed right for the desired speed.
  
  Major reason of my post is to discover the minor points of the design, like cracks and other difficulties.
  
  5.5 mtr is 18Ft in my opinion, and just about the size I can handle solo getting the cat in and out of the water.
  Also my marina will charge me more above 18Ft.
  I am sailing on budget, so carbon A cats are out of the question.
  
  

  halfcat

  The 18sm is fast with a new main (square top, Elliot/Patterson) and well rigged. Takes some practice to get to top of potential. usually out sails a F18 upwind but is slower downwind. If you add a spinnaker (Nacra sells a kit or you can add one yourself -F18 kit would work) it's faster downwind too. If you seal the mast you should not ever have a problem righting the boat yourself. Some of the older boats have stress cracks and need to be reinforced from time to time but can be competitive if sailed well. Portsmouth #'s are wrong since there are not a lot of them, shouldn't give time(without spinnaker) to an a-cat since it's a heavier boat even given the SA delta.

  
  @ halfcat
  will put a spinnaker on it, if I get it.....
  What about stress cracks and where to look for them ?
  In Europe we use the Texel-rating yardstick, its not for me though.
  As a sound-engineer working theatershows, my weekend is mondays
  till wednessday. Main reason I sail solo and no reggata's, but speed
  is a challenge.
  
  
  regards, André
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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• halfcat
  
  

  • Rank: Lubber
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  Posted: Dec 02, 2010 - 09:12 AM

  Stress cracks can be anywhere, a lot depends on how carefully they've been taken care of. These boats were built to be light, some of the initial ones may have been a little too light but I don't have any hull numbers/years that I can point to, only observations from some people that have sailed in the class for a long time. We have probably the biggest fleet anywhere of Nacra 18s in NC, these guys chose the boat as a fleet and maintained a large number for many years but as cycles usually go the new trend is A-Cats. I would check the seams on the bottom of the hulls and the holes where the bolts connect that hold the straps for the crossbeams, these holes seem to crack and give up over time. The deck where the skipper sits to go out onto the trap is also where the hulls seem to be a little soft/under built, often resulting in leaking. Most of the boats around here have had a lot of inspection ports added and these ALWAYS leak.
  
  I had a Nacra 18sqm and rebuilt the hulls and then sold it, my long term goal is to use an A-cat as a base and build an 18sqm from the hulls, 11' wide and a carbon mast, probably nacra 20 section and a spinnaker. Under Portsmouth we have an established rating for Nacra 18sq over 350 lbs and under, I think an A-Cat/18sqm w/ spinnaker could weigh about 225. I've been watching Whites Dragon on facebook and I like the work he did to the a-cat to reinforce the hulls and move the stress of the shrouds to the "frame" that he made w/ the crossbeams and the longitudinal additions, I think my A-Cat/18sqm would use a similar approach. My biggest concern w/ the A-cat platform is having enough buoyancy in waves to keep the boat moving since I'm bigger 100+kg and adding 40-50 lbs in reinforcing, crossbeams, more sail, more mast, spinnaker, etc may cause a lot of wave drag and slow the boat.

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 14, 2010 - 05:10 PM

  Last weekend the owner told my it was sold....
  Yesterday he called me that deal went bad.
  So , next thursday we have a meeting to inspect
  the 18m2, curious I am.
  Thanks, Halfcat for the helpfull information, will
  keep them in mind next thursday
  
  Greetings, Andre
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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• catmodding
  
  

  • Rank: Mate
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  Posted: Dec 17, 2010 - 07:39 PM

  Amsterdam, the Netherlands is covered in 7-8 inches of snow, traffic jams everywhere till late in
  the evening. Very rare in our country.
  Rescheduled appointment till most of the snow is gone.
  
  Grtz, A
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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• DamonLinkous
  
  

  • Rank: Administrator
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  Posted: Dec 17, 2010 - 08:48 PM

  A lot of the 18 Squares that are found were kind of home-built following the class rules, but here is a brochure on the factory Nacra 18 Square.
  
  
  --
  Damon Linkous
  1992 Hobie 18
  Memphis, TN
  
  How To Create Your Signature
  
  How To Create Your Own Cool Avatar
  
  How To Display Pictures In The Forums.
  --

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• erice
  
  

  • Rank: Mate
  • Registered: Feb 19, 2008
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  Posted: Dec 18, 2010 - 07:56 PM

  yup, the black ice is causing chaos in cities that usually don't get it. pity this audi owner. from a few days ago in geneva
  
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKxy5Vst7Mo
  
  
  
  Edited by erice on Dec 18, 2010 - 05:59 PM.

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Feb 07, 2011 - 10:09 PM

  Deal went bad, worn mainsail. worn tramp. Think I am gonna invest in a new tramp
  on my P 18-8 and also put a spi pole on it.
  Today I'm going to pick up my dry-suit wich I had made after watching the P16 icebreaker
  video. Though to get a suit in my size.
  Temperatures are around 40's overhere. Hopefully I am sailing next month with my new suit.
  
  A.
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

  • 
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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Feb 07, 2011 - 10:11 PM

  sorry that's a P 18-2 ......
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

  • 
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• 18sq
  
  

  • Rank: Lubber
  • Registered: Feb 13, 2011
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  Posted: Feb 13, 2011 - 03:20 PM

  Think I bought it, André...
  
  I'm really curious to sail it, but I'm gonna wait till our lake is defrosted... ^^
  Ok, rather till April or so. Then I'll tell you about my speed (110 kilo, 197cm )...
  maybee it'll need a spinnaker

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• erice
  
  

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  Posted: Feb 13, 2011 - 05:48 PM

  congrats on the new boat
  
  think we would probably all love to see some pics when you get her sailing
  
  never seen 1 in the flesh myself but from the pics some of them seem to have had flexy tapering masts, unlike the 5.2 for example that has a constant sized extrusion
  
  if it does have a tapering mast do your research carefully before mounting a spin

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Feb 13, 2011 - 10:40 PM

  Congrats on your new cat, 18 sqm, if you fill in your personals in the members panel we can have
  chat and maybe a meeting to see how its sailing on our almost defrosted lake.
  Next tuesday I'm gonna put the mast up and set the trampoline. Just waiting for a good dry-suit
  coming my way.
  I am really curious how the cat sails!
  
  Grtz, André
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

  • 
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• daniel_t
  
  

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  Posted: Oct 05, 2011 - 07:45 PM

  I know I'm late to the party here, but just an FYI:
  
  Portsmouth Yardstick for the two boats in question:
  18m2 (Cat.2 incl 11' N5.5) -- 67.2
  Prindle 18-2 -- 69.1
  
  So the 18m2 should be just a hair faster than the Prindle.
  
  --
  Daniel T.
  Taipan F16 - USA 213
  Clearwater, FL
  --

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• 18sq
  
  

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  Posted: Oct 06, 2011 - 09:23 AM

  At first: Sorry for my English.
  
  I have not been out sailing so much this summer unfortunately and tested wind-conditions only from about 2bft to 5bft.
  
  Allthoug Catstick- and Texelratings of the boat are very hard, it can't compete with -for example- modern A-cats. The 18sq was a lot slower when I sailed it at about 3 bft, maybee I could still improve the trim of the 18sq, but the difference was quite evident.
  
  Untill now I even went faster with my recent Nacra 6.0 (18,5 kt compared to 17kt with the 18sq). But I have the feeling more is possible... (with 6bft :) ). When the wind gets harder, the 18sq is a boat still nice to sail...
  
  Maybee that the 18sq can go higher up to the wind than other boates is the main advantage - not the speed.
  
  But I'll go on trying...
  
  
  
  Edited by 18sq on Oct 06, 2011 - 10:23 AM.

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Oct 06, 2011 - 02:36 PM

  18sq
  
  Nice to see you on the forum again. Bin a while for me too. Do You sail on the ijselmeer lake in
  the Netherlands? Would like to see the 18sqm. The fall is starting here quite rapidly, still like to go
  out for a sail.
  Managed 16.9 knts last Tuesday on the completely renovated P18-2 . Took the cat to France last summer,
  Atlantic ocean 18.3 max speed there.
  Speed is not the only reason sailing a cat, its a lot of fun to. The reason I started this post was the soloist in me
  looking for a faster boat within a certain budget.
  After the decision to renovate the prindle, I found the boat is a handful at topspeed sailing solo. Also the inexperience ( coming from 30 yrs monohull sailing) on my part did not help much .
  I go out sailing as much as possibly and still discover new (downwind) tricky stuff, but I'm gonna keep my
  precious P18-2 until she falls apart!
  Still like to see your 18 Sqm and sail together
  
  regards, A
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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• klozhald
  
  

  • Rank: Chief
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  Posted: Oct 07, 2011 - 12:06 AM

  catmodding,
  Have you put foot straps at the after end of your hulls for that high speed downwind situation, and/or rigged a Hawaiian style righting line that you can hang onto downwind to stay aft? I am interested to see what works for others. At this point I am just using an adjustable trapeze but as I get the courage to stay out, I have difficulty doing it well. Any advice is appreciated.
  
  --
  Sheet In!
  Bob
  _/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
  Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
  Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
  AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
  (Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
  Arizona, USA
  --

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• catmodding
  
  

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  Posted: Oct 07, 2011 - 04:08 AM

  @ Bob,
  Yes,I did put footstraps on the hulls behind the rear-beams. No extra lines to keep me on board, to dangerous in
  my opinion. Also my trapeze-hook is one of the "open" type. On a downwind track I will not go out on the wire when the waves are high or choppy, I'm not that kind of hero yet, maybe in the future... Also have the adjustable trapeze.
  At certain wind-angles on my hometown lake, the wind-force can go up to 5 Bf without developing any major waves,these are the moments I reach the speed mentioned.
  Other than that I removed the 4-way jib system, it is to complicated when you're on you're own , it hurts my knees and ruins my expensive dry-suit. Gain in speed is minimal for what it brings on complexity on board.
  Removed the second trapeze-wire for a even cleaner boat.
  Did put the cleats on the sheet-blocks in the "up" position, difficult to cleat, easy to uncleat.
  Will try to post some pics this weekend.
  
  Regards, Andre
  
  --
  Tornado (80's Reg White)
  Prindle 18-2 (sold)
  Dart 16 (hired and hooked)
  13 mtr steel cutter (sold)
  Etap 22, unsinkable sailing pocket cruiser.
  
  Amsterdam, the Netherlands
  --

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