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NOOBIE ALERT, need help with gin pole choice  Bottom

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  • I puckered when the trap line snapped... Mostly because I use trap lines as well, but hook up both on each side, just in case like this. I move people away, except for one person kind of monitoring shrouds to keep the mast going straight. Don't really like anyone there and will be building better connection points and a permanently mounted Gin pole to trailer.

    Rope seems to fail a lot slower...most times.

    Why did their trap line break? Too much tension? (As stated I re-tension like 3 times while raising - a pain).

    --
    Chuck C.
    H21SE 408
    --
  • QuoteWhy did their trap line break? Too much tension? (As stated I re-tension like 3 times while raising - a pain).

    Yes - he was using tiedown straps around the beam to adjust the tension and apparently didn't adjust as needed.

    the rigging on that boat was pretty well used and was probably in need of replacement years ago

    In the first vid u posted the guy's mainblocks must have about 1000000' of line in them to get them to the end of that jin pole when it's at rest . (seriously looks like around 10' of payed out line on a 6:1 = 60' of line
  • One additional point. The gin pole pivot should be on the trailer, not the cross bar. Lot's of front cross bars fail from their normal mast loads, particularly the newer Nacra ones. Let the trailer take the beating since it is easily and cheaply fixed. So, unless it is on a H16, which was built to be rammed up onto the beach, better put it on the trailer.
  • QuoteOne additional point. The gin pole pivot should be on the trailer, not the cross bar. Lot's of front cross bars fail from their normal mast loads, particularly the newer Nacra ones. Let the trailer take the beating since it is easily and cheaply fixed. So, unless it is on a H16, which was built to be rammed up onto the beach, better put it on the trailer.


    Lots of beams fail from normal mast loads? - i have only seen this 1 time in my 1000's of times sailing cats - it was an experimental f16 (gcat turbo)

    I have used jinpoles on hobie18's, hobie21's, Supercats and Farrier 31's (45' mast) since the 90's when i got into beachcats - I have never seen or heard of a beam failing during use of a jin pole. Not saying it can't but this is not a common issue.



    Edited by MN3 on Sep 06, 2019 - 09:32 AM.
  • MN3
    QuoteOne additional point. The gin pole pivot should be on the trailer, not the cross bar. Lot's of front cross bars fail from their normal mast loads, particularly the newer Nacra ones. Let the trailer take the beating since it is easily and cheaply fixed. So, unless it is on a H16, which was built to be rammed up onto the beach, better put it on the trailer.


    Lots of beams fail from normal mast loads? - i have only seen this 1 time in my 1000's of times sailing cats - it was an experimental f16 (gcat turbo)

    I have used jinpoles on hobie18's, hobie21's, Supercats and Farrier 31's (45' mast) since the 90's when i got into beachcats - I have never seen or heard of a beam failing during use of a jin pole. Not saying it can't but this is not a common issue.Edited by MN3 on Sep 06, 2019 - 09:32 AM.


    Seen a few NACRAs fail recently on well maintained boats (I believe the dolphin striker exploded on some of them then caused collapse of the main beam) , H17s used to fail. Newer stuff has fatter and thinner beams. The much older boats had nice thick beams. Anyway, my preference would be to let the trailer take the beating when something needs to. Not that you can't do it off the trailer, but given a choice to build it one way or the other ...
  • QuoteAnyway, my preference would be to let the trailer take the beating when something needs to. Not that you can't do it off the trailer, but given a choice to build it one way or the other ...

    fair enough, i am all in favor of reducing spar/metal fatigue when possible

    I can't figure out how your set-up works (if your pivot is infront of the beam, how does the mast end up inine with the mast base) - very interested to see other images of it in use

    Thanks for all your input - seems to come from an experienced pov
  • I've added three pictures of the gin pole. I will shoot some more when I set it up a week from now. The pictures rotated strangely. One shows the vertical brace, the other shows me holding up the pole by the hook, the other shows the winch location. The hook connects to both the winch rope and a loop at the bottom of the forestay.
    https://www.thebeachcats.com/pictures?g2_itemId=132171
  • I watched some old guy with a very simple and workable system. He had an extendable mast support (yoke) so he was able to get the starting point high enough so as to not cause too much load at the mast step. It was easy for him to winch it up but he had someone standing on the tramp to keep the mast from swinging out to the side. The line that he was using to winch with was tied in a big loop above the spreaders so he could remove it easily. Don't underestimate your ability to step the mast the old fashion way. Put your boat on the trailer backwards as previously mentioned. It's as much coordination as brute strength especially positioning your grip around those pesky diamond wires. I'm 69 and can still do it and when I can't I'll probably stop beach cat sailing.

    --
    Bill Townsend
    G-Cat 5.7
    Sarasota
    --
  • QuoteI watched some old guy with a very simple and workable system. He had an extendable mast support (yoke) so he was able to get the starting point high enough so as to not cause too much load at the mast step. It was easy for him to winch it up

    I'm not that old :)

    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=132204&g2_serialNumber=3

    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=132205&g2_serialNumber=3

    https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=132203&g2_serialNumber=3

    sidenote: not sure how his is rigged but i don't need anyone to hold my yoke or mast as i extend it - it is pretty rock solid

    I don't need any help at all since i can use my spin halyard to lock the main in the upright possition but i will take help with someone on a line attached to the halyard every time

    QuoteIt's as much coordination as brute strength especially positioning your grip around those pesky diamond wires. I'm 69 and can still do it and when I can't I'll probably stop beach cat sailing.

    +1 but my 30 and 31' masts are a lot heavier than your 28' gcat mast (if stock)

    I agree though if you can't solo step it - you probably can't solo right it - so mechanical advantage may be the only "safe" way (i need righting bags)
  • QuoteThe pictures rotated strangely. One shows the vertical brace, the other shows me holding up the pole by the hook, the other shows the winch location. The hook connects to both the winch rope and a loop at the bottom of the forestay.


    i was able to save them to my desk top and view them correctly (and tired to reupload but they were still wrong)_

    i think i understand. probably need to see it rigged to verify what i envision but looks cool - as i said/ i am all in favor of reducing stress and wear on legacy cats / all boats really

    lt looks like the geometry must be precise to work (as most things jin pole are), but that is much easier to adjust and dial in on a trailer that utilizes slots to slide and move all the different components and supports ( trailex trailer) vs a mechanical welds or bolts -

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