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hobie capsize over and over and over  Bottom

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  • jfrickerThat was sobering. The crew was having constant trouble unhooking, and it looked like the boat was going to turtle on top of her while she dangled from the hook. I need to think about the righting line on my Prindle, which is stuffed in the tramp pocket and not easy or fast to get to. It sure would be nice if the Prindle had a way to rig a righting line along the hull that you could easily reach, or maybe I need to think about a righting pole.

    Also thinking about an externally strapped knife for quick access, a SCUBA inflatable tube for visability in high seas, bright colored hat (instead of camo!)....


    Here is what you do. you can buy one like this:
    http://www.murrays.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/01-8292.jpg

    http://www.murrays.com/mm…_Code=C-RI&Store_Code=MS

    Or you can make the same thing take a very small block similar to what you use for trap line return. use a short length of 1/8 in line and tie it to the pad eye you put your traveler knot through on the rear beam. You can add another tang if you want but you don't really need to.

    Next you need a block big enough to handle the width of the line you choose to use for righting. If it is long enough you may be able to use the one you already have. tie or otherwise attach the block to the end of some shock cord. It should be long enough to reach from the from beam to the rear beam putting only a small amount of stretch in the line. Just enough to keep it taught. Run the other end of the shock cord through the small block you tied to the rear beam and back to your front beam. Tie it to your DS rod.

    Now you have 2 choices. You can install a pad eye on each side of your front beam to tie the ends of your righting line 2 or do what I did and just tie the end of your righting line around the outside of your front beam. To do this with the tramp on push the line up through the front corner of one side of our tramp. Go around the front of your beam in a loop and reattach with a bowline knot. ( I actually went along the bottom of where the beam is attached to the hull and around the outside of the end cap keeping the line tucked under the lip and them back along the front.) Take the other end and run it through the block attached to the shockcord and back to the opposite front beam making a big V shape. Tie that end on the beam like the first one. Tie it so it is tight enough to be stretched tight while in the V shape.

    Now from the bottom of the boat you can reach it and pull the shockcord will allow it to be pulled out to hang on to right the boat then when done the shock cord will automatically return it to its stored position. No need to get out and put away it's where you need it when you need it.

    --
    Dustin Finlinson • Magna, UT
    Member: Utah Sailing Association
    1982 Prindle 18
    1986 Hobie 17
    1982 Prindle 16
    1980 Prindle 16(mostly)
    1976 Prindle 16(mostly)

    Check out "Prindle Sailors" on Facebook.
    --
  • daniel_t
    QuoteSpecifically, what would you do differently?

    her life vest was riding up, practically covering her face. I see this kind of problem a lot. The vest isn't comfortable so people will loosen up the straps, then when they hit the water, the vest causes more problems than it cures. Tighten up that vest! Make sure it won't ride up on you.


    finally got to watch the video after using

    hidemyass.com

    to get around youtube's regional block

    you guys already said what needs to be said

    but can't resist commenting on the quote above

    when i started parachuting

    having all the harness real tight never mattered

    as adrenaline filled body never noticed

    but after getting used to it

    if we had any delays, would loosen the straps until just before the jump

    until forgot

    and came down with the chest strap across my nose

    as they say, and like that cat experience

    "that'll learn ya"
  • HAHAHAHA! I can second that, but from another direction. I did the first several jumps in the AFF course, but then I got back into sailing and could only afford one or the other. I picked sailing. But those jumps stuck with me. One of my mentors told me NEVER to jump with loose straps at the crotch. "Why?" I asked. "Because it feels like someone kicked you in the nads if you do."

    My current job involves a lot of work in high places. Any time we go up, we wear fall protection. The harness I use, a DBI Sala Exofit, looks exactly like a parachute harness without the container and risers. I'm picky about my harness, and don't really appreciate it when someone grabs mine instead of theirs, and then proceeds to change all my strap settings. People laughed at how tight I keep the leg straps until I told them the skydiving story. A lot of harnesses got a lot tighter after that!

    So far it's been academic, though. I don't think we've had a single fall since I started working here ten years ago. I'm happy to keep it that way!

    Tom

    --
    Tom Benedict
    Island of Hawaii
    P-Cat 18 / Sail# 361 / HA 7633 H / "Smilodon"
    --
  • QuoteNow from the bottom of the boat you can reach it and pull the shockcord will allow it to be pulled out to hang on to right the boat then when done the shock cord will automatically return it to its stored position. No need to get out and put away it's where you need it when you need it.


    Dustin - I like that layout. One question, does pulling from the inside (or bottom) of the hull instead of from over the top of the hull reduce the righting moment and make it harder to right the boat? I need all the help I can righting it solo.

    --
    John Fricker
    Prindle 16
    Seabrook, Texas
    --
  • Wow, losing sight of the crew, serious scary stuff, way more action then what you had hoped for I bet. I bet you were exhausted after the first capsize but I'm curious about the attempted jibe actions afterwards that appear to result in two more pitch poles. At the moment what was the thoughts behind these, trying to get closer to the crew or were you trying to fix the jib to prevent further flips? Great job and thank goodness everybody was safe at the end. I'm chalking down a personal note: "Whatever happens, never ever ever EVER let go of the boat...."

    --
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    Marc C.
    Cleveland, Ohio.
    Current love: Nacra 5.0
    Old loves: Int Laser, Int Europe, Int 470, Int 420, Vaurien
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    --
  • jfricker: I have a Prindle 16 and I use the same righting line setup as quarath shows. I am UNABLE to right the boat by pulling the rope under the hull! I find that tossing it over the top of the hull provides a little extra angle. Anything helps! It's easy to rig underneath the trampoline and leave a knot in a circle that you can use around your wrist or just a better grip.

    I have not used a righting back, basically I have not wanted to buy one. But I weigh 175 and I think that the added weight of a righting back over my shoulder combined with the rope over the top of the hull would pop the boat right up.

    I keep a large "water tight" bag tucked into one of my tramp pockets, (it also works as a sail bag for my jib during storage) and I think I'll grab for that to use as a righting bag if my body weight isn't enough next time.

    --
    Redondo Beach, CA
    '80 Prindle 16.
    (Got it for free!)
    --
  • I'll chime in w/ some additional info on Dustin's post.

    I set up my own righting system similar to the above using extra parts. I have the top of the "V" shaped line secured to the front crossbar with a Bowline. In the future I may upgrade to adding a padeye to either side of the crossbar to make it look better. For now I want to test it out before I spend any money on it.

    The line is a portion of my old main sheet. I cut the old forestay pigtail off and reused the stainless ring and ran my main through the ring and secured the shock cord to the ring.

    I added an old trap block to the rear crossbar with a padeye and ran my shockcord from the ring through the block to the DS rod. I secured it with just enough tension so that I can pull the righting line nearly parallel with the front crossbar. I figure this will allow me to fully hike out when trying to right the cat. I read somewhere that a bowline will hold in shockcord but I need to verify that. I played with it on the lawn and the setup is very simple and it seems to work and return to center every time.

    I tool the remaining length of mainsheet and set up a traditional recovery line but added in some barrel knots for hand grips and a bowline loop at the very end so that you can put you foot in it to get back on board if you aren't the most nimble of people.

    My overall cost was $4 for 2 rivets and a padeye. Everything else came out of the parts bin, You could as Dustin mentioned run a line from the traveler padeye but I opted for adding in another padeye so that the force is pulling in the same direction as the rivets versus some angle greater than 90*. I'm sure its strong enough attached to the traveler; but I had the crossbars off and for $4 I wanted to keep it neat.

    Let me know if you want Pics

    --
    Bob Miller
    1983 P16 Sail # 7312
    "Miller Time" A work in progress; out of the water for 16 years
    Barnegat Bay NJ
    Beach Cat Lesson #1 - A free cat isn't
    Find more Prindles on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/173120656090532/
    --
  • jfrickerDustin - I like that layout. One question, does pulling from the inside (or bottom) of the hull instead of from over the top of the hull reduce the righting moment and make it harder to right the boat? I need all the help I can righting it solo.


    No, it doesn't matter, but it might be a little harder to hold on to the line since it will be more horizontal than otherwise. Also, and this is important I think, you will find it harder to stand at the bow and right the boat with that system so it will be harder to keep the boat facing into the wind.

    --
    Daniel T.
    Taipan F16 - USA 213
    Clearwater, FL
    --
  • covered in great detail here - http://www.catsailor.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=239400&page=1
  • jfricker
    QuoteNow from the bottom of the boat you can reach it and pull the shockcord will allow it to be pulled out to hang on to right the boat then when done the shock cord will automatically return it to its stored position. No need to get out and put away it's where you need it when you need it.


    Dustin - I like that layout. One question, does pulling from the inside (or bottom) of the hull instead of from over the top of the hull reduce the righting moment and make it harder to right the boat? I need all the help I can righting it solo.


    I had not problem but I have the weight to do it. I think that over the top could give you a little extra.

    I have seen it done like this on a Prindle as well.

    http://www.murrays.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/01-3293.jpg

    http://www.murrays.com/mm…_Code=C-RI&Store_Code=MS

    In this case the line was not tied at the beam but passed trough a large pad eye riveted on the bottom of each beam then went over the top of the deck in front of the beam and trailed down the outside of the hull and attached somewhere at the back. I believe to a hole drilled through the deck lip. The one I saw had a series of knots tied along it. I though it would be to hard for me to get the line loose enough fall down from the hull in the air so opted for the other one.

    --
    Dustin Finlinson • Magna, UT
    Member: Utah Sailing Association
    1982 Prindle 18
    1986 Hobie 17
    1982 Prindle 16
    1980 Prindle 16(mostly)
    1976 Prindle 16(mostly)

    Check out "Prindle Sailors" on Facebook.
    --
  • Quotecovered in great detail here - http://www.catsailor.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=239400&page=1


    I'm not sure they ever agreed! It does not matter if the righting line is over or under the top hull, it's how far out you can get when leaning back, and how much weight you carry. If you laid out on a dagger board in the same position you could lean out with a righting line, you would have equal righting moments. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

    --
    John Fricker
    Prindle 16
    Seabrook, Texas
    --
  • Quoteit's how far out you can get when leaning back, and how much weight you carry.

    but you can lean out further with the line further away from the hull in the water... and that means... out and over the top hull (IMHO)

    QuoteIf you laid out on a dagger board in the same position you could lean out with a righting line, you would have equal righting moments.

    yes but you would be under water faster and thus loose you righting momentum
  • I have spent the last week trying to get this video out of my head. No can do.

    Today I picked up a set of personal locator flares and a new throwable PFD. We have knives and whistles already in PFD chest pockets, and borrowed VHF radios.

    It strikes me that the best tool in this situation is man overboard expertise, and using my head while still on shore. I have stood in the sand and bailed on races in the past due to severe conditions. Right now I feel great about every one of those decisions.

    Thanks, MN3, for posting this. It has had significant impact.



    Edited by klozhald on May 15, 2012 - 01:09 PM.

    --
    Sheet In!
    Bob
    _/)_____/)_/)____/)____/)_____/)/)__________/)__
    Prindle 18-2 #244 "Wakizashi"
    Prindle 16 #3690 "Pegasus" Sold (sigh)
    AZ Multihull Fleet 42 member
    (Way) Past Commodore of Prindle Fleet 14
    Arizona, USA
    --
  • I, too, have watched this video a number of times. I have never sailed in those conditions, but I've experienced each one of those problems over several years, just not on the same excursion. I bought new PFDs with pockets, and whistles, line cutter and sailing knives for the kids.



    Edited by lesgawlik on May 15, 2012 - 07:31 PM.

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