Like Sam; the same question, "what boat?"
Personally, I would and do use Landenberger, 1D or Glasser. With the Euro down right now, opportunities for sails from there are better than ever. Felix at Landenberger does an awesome job and their customer service is GREAT.
I don't have any 1D sails, but with the pictures of their sails that I have seen and since their history is rooted in the Ullman loft that Pablo ran, I suspect they make nice kit. I do have a really nice set of Pablo's Tornado sails and they are beautiful!
We've had Jay make a spinnaker for us a couple of years ago and just like Landenberger, you can see the attention to detail and craftsmanship in their work. Last I knew, unlike some lofts, they do not farm the work out to production facility in China/Taiwan/etc. and do everything in-house.
I bought a stock jib and a 130% jib for my Stiletto 27 from Schurr in 2012. They were both made from diamond cut dacron and both sails worked really well. At the time, Randy Smythe had a large hand in design. My experience with Schurr was very good.
Prindle 18 classic
Have never done business with them... I have three... no make that four great sail makers in my back yard... But I did come across a NACRA 5.8 with a set of them... they looked pretty darn good...
I can understand your wanting to vett the sail maker... with investing a possible $2K I too would do this... If it is any comfort, they all pretty much use the same or similar materials. I know that the four in my backyard probably use the same distributor for the material.
A lot of good info here
What kind of boat are these sails for?
Edited by JohnES on Jun 19, 2017 - 11:52 AM.
As others have said, a little more information about your needs and priorities would help.
Also your location, in case you happen to live close to one of the sailmakers mentioned.
1992 Hobie 18
How To Create Your Signature
How To Create Your Own Cool Avatar
How To Display Pictures I…he Forums in the forums.
I'm going to second the advice to go with a European sail maker at the moment, depending on your location and boat. In the U.S, for performance laminate beachcat sails, it is very hard to go wrong with Glaser. In Europe, Hyde, Performance, 1D, landenberger, and Grant Piggott all build fast beachcat sails at great prices.
I have a Nacra 500 and settled on EP Sails. Skip has been great to work with and has a lot of experience with the Nacra sails. Hunter with Shurr Sails was my other consideration and he was also very very good to work with. i would not hesitate to give Schurr sails a shot at you next set of sails.
Thanks for all of your inputs. Ill post pics when i get it all together .
My only commentary on EP sails is that their window materials SUCK (in my limited experience - based on the 2nd hand sails I've used).
We've blown out the windows on every one of the 2nd hand EP sails in our inventory (1x ~7 year old practice main, 1x very good racing main, 1 old jib) - each time in capsizes. Perhaps the older sails' window materials were just tired, but the EP racing main was fairly new and barely used so should not have blown. We also blew a jib window on an old Hobie Tiger stock jib - so not just an EP problem)
When we had Chip at Whirlwind Sails replace the window on the old EP main, he used a window material that had 3 strands of criss-crossing fibers through the windows (vs. only 2 diagonal strands criss-crossing in the EP sails). That looks a lot stronger, so I'd recommend asking EP for stronger window options, unless you plan to never capsize...
Note: My experience was with Nacra Inter 20 sails.
Here was our racing mainsail window before our capsize (see pic #2):
Here was the racing mainsail window after only one capsize (we taped it up with Dacron tape) (see starting 4:30): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTWp4DP0VcA
Nacra Inter 20 (sold)
2017 Race to Alaska "Team Ketch me if u can"
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TeamKetch/
- Race video highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YTWp4DP0VcA
This is the first I've heard of a blown window on a set of EP sails or any mylar sails for that matter. It is a week spot on the sails though and you've likely sailed in bigger conditions than most (huge congrats on finishing the R2AK on an I20, makes a Tybee 500 finish look weak!!). Skip has fantastic customer service and has always treated me right. My biggest complaint is his designs are dated (not his fault, mandated by Nacra), and there were some QC issues...the top 20 teams would usually buy multiples sails at one time, pick the best bunch and send the rest back as a result. I don't think this problem is limited to EP though, most lofts are outsourcing production and that can be tough to control. Glaser has better QC but you pay for it.
I have killed many windows
here in fl - it's crazy uv and heat - this is probably why i go through so many but i have "sailed" through a few in my day as well - i really doubt any one would survive a capsize where someone lands on the window
I would rather my $100 window explode vs extra stretching on my main
I just replaced a window on a relatively new sail - When replaced the "other" shop was surprised at how thin the window material was - i hadn't thought about it or noticed it but it sure died quickly (about 2 seasons)
so i guess next time to I will pay attention and ask specific questions about what type and weight the window is
Good info about sail windows. I made a regular habit of capsizing my N20 last fall, and the window of my EP main held up fine. More than I can say for the boom. Karate chopped that right in half. Just purchased a barely used end pole N20 spin from a guy and sent it off to Skip at EP to have it converted to a mid pole snuffer Spin (add 3 retrieval patches). He did it for a very fair price, and the sail is beautiful. Can't wait to fly this baby!
Glaser did my Square sail, and I was very pleased. That said, at the time, I lived near to Charlie Ogletree, who came to the boat and measured. Both Charlie and Jay were working for Ullman then.
When I bought sails for my ex-trimaran, Smyth was having his stuff built at Schurr (AKA 'Hunter'). A year after the purchase, was racing at the nats in Pcola, and the jib clew tore. Hunter was on scene and had no qualms about supporting the product and in fact fixed the sail overnight, gratis.
I bought the sails for my big cat from Hunter, and he came to the boat and measured, delivered the product, installed, and sailed with us to make sure the product was to our liking. A two-hour drive, and Hunter will drive to NOLA.
Hunter is a stand up guy. He has done several N20 and other small multi sails, so he is familiar with multihulls. If you are local to Schurr, by all means do biz. You won't be sorry.
BTW it is my understanding that these days, Smyth is having his sails made in Asia. That said, so is most everyone else. As long as the designer backs the product, so what?
Edited by jaybird1111 on Jun 24, 2017 - 09:31 AM.
Having a F18 jib made at Schurr sails as we speak . Hunter does a great job . There isn't a sail maker out there that hasn't has sail failure . I would not use someone else' bad fortune to judge a sail maker .. Nacra carbon 20 mainsail made at Schurr won Florida 300 .. I prefer to use a sail maker that is close and that you can sit down and discuss what you want
Pensacola , Fl.
Prindle 18-2 w/spin
Prindle 18-2 x 3
Prindle 19 MX