Anyone know if I could get a drum and swivel, have the boat shop rig up the forestay lengths and go or is there something I'm missing. My jib is the stock hank-on non-zipper-luff style if it matters.
Thanks,
Jimmy
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1983 Nacra 5.0 Sail #10
Dallas, Texas area
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Nacra 5.0 roller furling job conversion
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Posted: Jul 12, 2012 - 08:29 PM
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Posted: Jul 12, 2012 - 08:50 PM
That is how I did mine. I bought a used furling drum and swivel off of the classifieds here. Measured my forestay eye t eye (four times), Subtracted off the lenght of the furler, swivel and shackles. Sent the measurements to Annapolis Performance Sailing and within about 2 weeks I had a shiny new forestay with a pigtail and a bullet block (for the jib halyard). The hank on luff shouldnt' matter, you are spinning the forestay and the sail comes along for the ride.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 12:59 PM
Hey, do you have photos of your setup?
My P-Cat came with a roller furling jib, but no jib halyard. We basically have to zip it on, roll it up, and THEN raise the mast. For obvious reasons this isn't my favorite approach to take.
I've been poking around at roller furling jib conversion threads, gleaning ideas. I think I have everything I need now, but every little bit helps.
Thanks,
Tom
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Tom Benedict
Island of Hawaii
P-Cat 18 / Sail# 361 / HA 7633 H / "Smilodon"
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 05:19 PM
Here's the top with the swivel, pigtail and bullet block.
http://www.thebeachcats.c…ictures/?g2_itemId=74387
Here's the furler, adjuster and cleat for the halyard.
http://www.thebeachcats.c…ictures/?g2_itemId=74384
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 05:25 PM
Hey, thanks for the pictures. I think I'm on the right track with what I had planned.
The roller furling drum I have has a jam cleat built into the chainplate, but I picked up a Camcleat Racing jam cleat, similar to the one you have. If the weather holds we're sailing Saturday morning, but I might have a chance to set this up on Sunday.
Thanks again for the pictures.
Tom
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Tom Benedict
Island of Hawaii
P-Cat 18 / Sail# 361 / HA 7633 H / "Smilodon"
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 08:46 PM
It sounds obvious, but you need to connect that swivel & drum to your bridals & forestay. If your bridals terminate with forks,(as in Daves link), AND you have that kind of drum you are golden. If you are using the Harken drum, you will need to pick up a triangle plate such as this
.
If your bridals end in thimbles you need to connect the bow shackle around the thimbles to the fork at the bottom of the drum. Most shackles are not wide enough to span the drums fork. However you rig it, you want the load evenly split between the two sides of the fork.
At the top end, you cannot directly connect the swivel to the bow shackle that also holds the shrouds. The simplest is a short tang such as this
Note that one hole is larger, to allow the shackle end to pass through.
Don't get to hung up on an exact measurement for your new forestay. Many people incorporate a 10 hole adjuster on top of the drum. This allows for the stay being an inch or more to long, mast rake, provides an easy mount for your Davis wind indicator, clam cleat, etc.
There is no single "perfect" solution. What is best for a trailer sailor who races every week may not be best for one who keeps the mast up all year. Some simply tie the tack with a bit of line, & tie off the halyard to maintain jib tension.I prefer to hold tension with a clam cleat as my boats sit on seadoo lifts & the water is deep enough that is is awkward to reach up & tie anything.
I have seen small blocks rigged so as to give a 3:1 purchase, personally I feel that is hardware overkill. I currently am experimenting with a single block at the drum, leading jib halyard to the front beam, so I could tension & de tension the jib from the tramp. This really is not any advantage if you rig your boat on the beach, I found it useful as my boat never comes on land til season end. It was easier than placing a 2x6 across the bows at the dock, then walking out to tension the jib. Take all suggestions, but in the end, do what works for your individual situation.
Whatever you do, remember to tape the ringdings at the top end. Last year my mainsail halyard snagged a ringding on the swivel, & left it as only a bent piece of wire. Lose that pin & you lose the mast.
When leaving your boat for ANY length of time with the jib furled, use a safety, so it can't come unfurled. I use the original clam cleat on the mast for the furling line. To safety it, I wrap the tail around the mast & tie it. When I leave the boat for the night, I also run a thin line through the tack grommet, wrap it around the jib & tie. It's redundant, I know, but I sleep better in Hong Kong when I see storms on Ontario radar.
If your jib comes loose in a squall it will turn into dental floss. I don't personally know this fact, but Andrew(MN3) does
Finally, if you leave the jib on, as I do, spend $150 & have a sail maker sew a UV strip to the leech of the sail.
While they are at it, have them pull the jib battens & replace with double length battens, set at roughly the same angle as your forestay. Without those two small battens (talking Nacra here) the leech tends to vibrate & flog, especially when pinching. If the battens are left perpendicular to the mast, it furls like shiit.
I have been meaning to create a tech album on this subject for 2 years now. Many people here helped me with my first conversion. I'll quickly make an album with a bunch of basic photos, as that says more than pages of writing. I'll get to the captions later, I promise.
Edited by Edchris177 on Jul 13, 2012 - 08:52 PM.
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 09:55 PM
Actually i use an extra bow shackle at the top and used 3 at the bottom to connect a harken drum to me bridles. Your solution is simpler and likely is less finicky. But like you there ia more than one way to skin a cat. I war one of those tangs for my swivel. When i rig the 5.7 i will be using an rwo furler and swivel so i will probably order those parts for that system.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 11:17 PM
OK, here it is, a quick & dirty album on roller furling. Hope it helps.
If anyone has constructive criticism, edits, errors or omissions, please point them out
Please don't hack on me, this was just whipped up in the last few hours as I'm trying to waste a few more sleep deprived hours in the beautiful Sheraton, in not so beautiful downtown Shanghai.
http://www.thebeachcats.c…ictures/?g2_itemId=88268
Edited by Edchris177 on Jul 13, 2012 - 11:18 PM.
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Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
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Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
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Posted: Jul 13, 2012 - 11:21 PM
The photo of the tang was sent to me by Philip,(MUMMP) I believe. I don't actually use one. I didn't have access to one when I first rigged the system. What you see is a scrap of SS flat bar, with two holes drilled, courtesy of a cobalt 1/4" bit I had.
Ditto for the small tang below the drum.
Edited by Edchris177 on Jul 13, 2012 - 11:22 PM.
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Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
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Posted: Jul 14, 2012 - 03:39 AM
That's great, thanks for taking the time to do it and write all the descriptions. Too often someone uploads useful pics but doesn't write anything to go with so the pics can't be searched and the meaning of the image is lost with time.
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Damon Linkous
1992 Hobie 18
Memphis, TN
How To Create Your Signature
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Posted: Jul 14, 2012 - 06:05 AM
one of the pics you have is of my original furler setup on my H16, I was experimenting then.....
.....and you were quite correct in your assumption, I did not have a shackle large enough to attach the furling drum to the bridle wires, so I attached the stay adjuster 1st then the drum. I did not have to adjust mast rake so this worked for me at that time, an additional bonus was that the stay adjuster did not interfere with the jib tack, causing chafing.
I have now adopted this same furling rig to my G-Cat 5.0.......
pigtail + swivel + forestay + stay adjuster + furling drum = length of G-Cat original forestay,
.......purely co-incidental, but it worked, except this time I had a shackle large enough to attach the furling drum to the bridal wires. But now the 10-hole stay adjuster chafes on the jib tack when the jib is furled as I have the jib forestay secured in the 3rd hole down. To prevent this, I use electrical tape around the top part of the stay-adjuster where it rubs on the jib tack. JMTCW
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TurboHobo
H14T
H16
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G-Cat 5.0
P16
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Posted: Jul 14, 2012 - 05:39 PM
Part is called a Mast Tang Plate I20 Spin
Part #56-9649
Murrays has it, or check with a Nacra dealer.
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Philip
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 11:51 AM
Thanks guys, I'll add the credits & part #'s to the album
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Posted: Jul 15, 2012 - 05:51 PM
I used shackles to connect the P18 brides to the Hobie 18 style furler rather thn have new bridles made that he forks one end like th H18. Mine looks. Lot like Wolfman's
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Dustin Finlinson • Magna, UT
Member: Utah Sailing Association
1982 Prindle 18
1986 Hobie 17
1982 Prindle 16
1980 Prindle 16(mostly)
1976 Prindle 16(mostly)
Check out "Prindle Sailors" on Facebook.
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Posted: Sep 27, 2012 - 03:11 PM
Ok all, I have rigged up my furling system and it works great. The problem now is that when the wind really blows I notice my forestay bowing. Also, again when the wind is up, I have to haul down HARD on the jib halyard or the leading edge of the jib takes on a scalloped look between the hanks.
I'm not sure if I have the rig slightly too loose and may try tightening it up but don't want to go so tight that I impede the mast rotation.
Thoughts?
Thx, jimmy
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1983 Nacra 5.0 Sail #10
Dallas, Texas area
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Posted: Sep 27, 2012 - 04:28 PM
The prindles can run with a pretty tight rig without hurting rotation much. At least on mine it is.
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Dustin Finlinson • Magna, UT
Member: Utah Sailing Association
1982 Prindle 18
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Posted: Sep 27, 2012 - 07:45 PM
Chris,
FYI, the pic titled 'Andrews Roller Furling' is actually mine. Pretty sure he wouldn't want to take responsibility for that. :)
Quarath/Jimmy,
I run my 5.2 and 5.7 tight also. I actually have a Sta-master turnbuckle http://www.murrays.com/mm…de=02-104&Category_Code= on my forestay to tension my rig. Just because I am usually setting my rig up by myself so it simplifies the process. You really don't want the jib to be taking higher tension than the forestay.
A lack of jib luff tension will show itself by you being unable to stop the jib from luffing with sheet tension. It will just keep luffing uncontrallably (and annoyingly).
Edited by Wolfman on Sep 27, 2012 - 07:52 PM.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Sep 29, 2012 - 08:35 PM
Ok, this makes sense. Jib halyard was definitely tighter than the forestay which was causing the forestay to go slightly slack resulting in the scalloped leading edge on the jib. So, McLube the mast step ball, tighten the forestay and go!
Thanks, Jmmy
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1983 Nacra 5.0 Sail #10
Dallas, Texas area
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Posted: Sep 29, 2012 - 10:15 PM
Yeah, a bigger problem than you experienced is that the jib isnt made to take the tension the forestay is. You are lucky you didnt rip it like an old hulk hogan t shirt.
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Dave Bonin
1981 Nacra 5.2 "Lucile"
1986 Nacra 5.7 "Belle"
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
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Posted: Sep 29, 2012 - 10:17 PM
Hahaha, long live the 30-year old jib!!!
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1983 Nacra 5.0 Sail #10
Dallas, Texas area
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