• Edchris177
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 02:07 PM

  I found these in the rigging bag for my 5.7.
  The large white line is 3/4" x 23' long. Because of the knots, I'm assuming it is a righting line. Would you pass the loop end around the mast base, then pass the bitter end through the loop?
  The other part consists of an airblock (?) with a hook at one end, & a shackled block with cam cleat at the other, please feel free to correct this newbs nomenclature. If you expand the picture you can see that the two blocks are from different manufacturers, & the hook is not stainless material,leading me to believe it is not a factory part, but was made up by the previous owner. The hook does not look strong enough to used for any sail pulling, & the line is only 10' free. I'm thinking it was used to hoist a righting bag? There was no sign of a righting bag anywhere on the premises, so...
  If it is for a bag, where would you attach the shackle, or would you place the hook on the dolphin striker rod, & shackle the other end to the bag,...or other ideas? You can also see that the shackled end has a pin that allows the angle to be adjusted. Is there an obvious reason one would use this type of setup over a cheaper simpler block, other than that's what he had sitting around?
  Thanks.[][/img]
  
  
  
  edited by: Edchris177, Dec 09, 2009 - 01:16 PM
  
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• rpiper138
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 02:28 PM

  It looks like a righting bag setup to me.
  
  I try to avoid putting any stress on the dolphin triker rod unless it is parallel with the mast. The rod is really only that strong in one direction (the force is transferred to the dolphin striker and up to the front beam - 2 triangles).
  
  The shackle should attach to the righting bag. When you capsize, the righting line goes over the top hull. Then the hook attaches to the righting line (easiest is bowline on the bite). This means that you don't have to throw the righting bag and hardware over the upper hull and a/risk damage to the gelcoat from the hardware, b/suffer the 100 times that you will throw it and the bag will catch the wind and not make it over the hull.
  
  You may not need the additional purchase for the righting bag or the righting bag at all. Take everything with you and try righting without the bag. If you can avoid having to use the bag it will make your life a lot simpler and you can save the time and energy required to pull the f&%king righting bag back into the boat when it is dragging behind like a sea anchor (this will happen at the worse possible time).
  
  I had my righting bag come out of the tramp lacing and deploy behind the boat (attached directly to righting line, no additional purchase). The bag has never been used to right the boat, but is famous for getting in the way. I noticed that my leward bow was low while sailing in about 15 knots on a reach. Trapped out as far as I could with my foot in the strap on the stern, dropped the traveller, and the bow was still low. Hit a wave and cartwheeled only to realize that the righting line was wrapped around the leward bridle wire and the righting bag was dragging behind me. I hate that bag!

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• DamonLinkous
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 02:39 PM

  The righting bag pulleys look like this item from Murrays.
  
  http://www.murrays.com/mm…=MS&Product_Code=01-3273
  
  The reason for the pulleys is to give you 4-1 pull, water is heavy.
  
  
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• Edchris177
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 02:58 PM

  Cha Ching! score! I just knocked 100 clams off what I actually paid for the boat. I see the snap hook is a better setup than the one I have.
  It also looks to me that the pulleys are rigged wrong. IF you look at the picture you see the line going from a bowline, through the first pulley, then through a stainless "U". This will create friction,forcing the line against the sharp edge of the U. I'm thinking it should be outside of that U, allowing freedom to run.
  
  Rich 5.5 uni
  I use a sea anchor on my Lund Tyee to control drift while fishing. Tie a small diametre line to the CLOSED end of the bag. It only takes a very light pull to topple the bag, sort of like collapsing a parachute, then it is easy to pull in. I thought of your problem of the accidental deployment, I used to skydive as a younger man, and read about a plane crash due to a parachute deploying onboard. It went out the door but wrapped around the tail gear, to much drag to fly, but not enough for a survivable landing.
  When stowing the bag on my Lund it is either in a secured hatch, or if topside while moving under power to a new spot, cleat the collapsing line at a shorter length than the securing line. If it does go overboard, the collapsing line will pull tight first, thereby not allowing the bag to fill.
  
  I can hardly wait to go out & capsize in a controlled condition to experiment with righting it single handed. A question arises, how would you guys recommend capsizing the boat on a calm day? I want to do it off my dock, in 5' of water. Do you attach a line to the mast & pull gently, or have a few buddies hang from a mast line, while anchoring a hull to prevent the boat from just pulling over to them?
  
  
  
  edited by: Edchris177, Dec 09, 2009 - 02:13 PM
  
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• DamonLinkous
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 03:05 PM

  Edchris177

  Cha Ching! score! I just knocked 100 clams off what I actually paid for the boat. I see the snap hook is a better setup than the one I have.

  
  
  Yea, blocks are expensive, when I read our classifieds I'm often amazed at all the expensive stuff that gets "thrown in" with the sale. Many times the non-boat stuff is worth more than the total asking price.
  
  I guess people either forget how much they paid for all those items or just don't want to be bothered trying to sell them seperately.
  
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• yurdle
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 03:24 PM

  Quote

  If you can avoid having to use the bag it will make your life a lot simpler and you can save the time and energy required to pull the f&%king righting bag back into the boat when it is dragging behind like a sea anchor (this will happen at the worse possible time).

  
  
  Word.
  
  Ed I would use the hook to hang the bag from, and attach the shackle to the righting line just above whatever knot is highest when the boat is on its side.
  
  That spliced eye is nice, but if you attach it to the base of the mast a la luggage tag, make sure you carry a knife with you. I recently had my knotted righting line grab the rode from a buoy while I was struggling to bring the righting bag back on board. I had no knife and it took all I had to untie the bowline holding the line to the boat against the wind.
  
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• rpiper138
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 03:25 PM

  I would not capsize the boat unless there is enough wind to warrant a capsize. The wind plays a huge part in getting the boat righted. Capsizing on a calm day means way more work to get the thing upright again.
  
  If you are dead set on capsizing when calm, it's pretty easy.
  
  Unhook the bungee from your trap wire.
  hook your harness into the trap ring and get out on the side like you are trapezing.
  Jump - push out as far as you can with your legs. Sooner or later, the mast starts falling toward you.
  
  Remember to stay close to the boat as the mast falls, so it doesn't hit you and unhook from the trap as soon as the tesion comes off. Then swim under the hulls and work on righting it. It won't be fun with no wind!
  

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• MN3
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 03:34 PM

  Quote

  The shackle should attach to the righting bag. When you capsize, the righting line goes over the top hull. Then the hook attaches to the righting line (easiest is bowline on the bite).

  
  Actually... the shackle goes to the righting line and the hook goes to the bag.. look at Damon's pic. that is the correct alignment of the blocks / and most importantly the cleat
  
  

  Quote

  It also looks to me that the pulleys are rigged wrong. IF you look at the picture you see the line going from a bowline, through the first pulley, then through a stainless "U". This will create friction,forcing the line against the sharp edge of the U. I'm thinking it should be outside of that U, allowing freedom to run.

  
  It looks reved (run) correct to me, but i agree that eyestrap (u) looks like trouble (unless it swivels).
  
  
  

  Quote

  Do you attach a line to the mast & pull gently, or have a few buddies hang from a mast line, while anchoring a hull to prevent the boat from just pulling over to them?

  
  
  i would not suggest pulling a boat over via the mast... you dont wanna bend that...
  
  I am not sure my answer is correct on how to safely capsize either.. i have never tried... but...
  
  I would sit on the lee/low side with crew ... in 8 knots that should be plenty.. be careful when it comes down to avoid being knocked over the head. Have another boat nearby in case you need more help.
  
  MAKE SURE YOU SEAL UP YOUR MAST PRIOR TO CAPSIZING! :)

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• rpiper138
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 03:57 PM

  I have capsized in zero wind due to a halyard ring that would not come off of the hook. Using the trapeze works well if you are fat enough (no problem here).
  
  Now that I look at the original picture I see the point about block and cleat alignment and the mast sealing recommendation is excellent. I seal the mast yearly, but never think about it for the rest of the season.
  

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• yurdle
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 06:02 PM

  If you can get into shallower water with a helper you can just lift one side while the other pulls on the trap handle, then just lower it right over. I've done this more times than I can count to fix things at the top of the mast. You could then just drag the boat out to slightly deeper water and try to right it.
  
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• Edchris177
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 09, 2009 - 06:40 PM

  Thanks yurdle, I never thought of that method. I can pull it up close to the lawn, into as shallow as 2 1/2 feet of water. I only weigh 175, so I doubt I can right it myself, but I'd like to try different techniques, & experiment with different size water bags & would prefer not to do it out in the bay, drifting onto possibly a bad shore. Once I have some confidence it will make leaving the bay more comfortable.
  
  
  
  edited by: Edchris177, Dec 09, 2009 - 05:41 PM

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• smfinley
  
  

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  Posted: Dec 10, 2009 - 08:40 AM

  If you have 2 boats and at least 3 people I would try righting the boat in a moderate wind day out in an open area, where you can drift for a while. Have the other boat nearby incase you need a hand or the extra person. You will get tired very quickly hauling around those water bags, unless you are in great shape. I agree with Andrew, being on the leeward hull in moderate wind should do the trick, you can always stand up and lean out holding onto the side shroud if you need extra leverage.
  
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