Storing of Nacra 5.2

I recently got a Nacra 5.2 on a whim (no experience sailing cats, but have owned 25ft monohulls).

1) I have found an old black and white 1986 Nacra5.2 rigging guide/assembly guide. Does anyone have a color version or any other resources to help with rigging it for the first time ?

2) The boat is in the great Canadian shield. There is no flat spot for me to put, so had to build this ramp and winch system to get it out of the water. In the nacra assembly guide it says you should try and keep everything as flat as possible. Any thoughts about keep the boat like this for the length of the season ?


Thanks!

https://i.imgur.com/1fusKrm.png
Support the hulls as if it were on a trailer - should be fine. That is, use cradles instead of a a round bar or roller. It's really about distributing weight and not creating a pressure point.

Compliments on the simple, yet effective "ramp" with the guides to keep the beach wheels straight. Simple, yet effective. Boards won't wash away?

--
Chuck C.
H21SE 408
--
The reason they say keep it flat is that the platform could twist if you were to store it with 1 bow up higher than the other, for example. It is ok if both bows are pointed up while it is resting on the wheels. Especially if the wheels are under the daggerboard trunks.
You also don't want a ton of snow piling up on the tramp, so i would consider raising the bows with the plugs out.
charlescarlisSupport the hulls as if it were on a trailer - should be fine. That is, use cradles instead of a a round bar or roller. It's really about distributing weight and not creating a pressure point.

Compliments on the simple, yet effective "ramp" with the guides to keep the beach wheels straight. Simple, yet effective. Boards won't wash away?



rodgersThe reason they say keep it flat is that the platform could twist if you were to store it with 1 bow up higher than the other, for example. It is ok if both bows are pointed up while it is resting on the wheels. Especially if the wheels are under the daggerboard trunks.
You also don't want a ton of snow piling up on the tramp, so i would consider raising the bows with the plugs out.


Thank you! It's 2 12 foot long sections that are married together with a hinge. Used lots of boulders to wedge everything in place. For the time being there's enough weight on the boards and they're secured in the sand that they won't go anywhere.
When winter comes I'll be able to lift the boards that are in the water up and secure them... At least that's the idea:)
BTW, right or wrong I store my boat way nose-up with plugs out to keep the hulls dry. I do it by jacking up the nose of my trailer, but same impact; basically no ill effects noticed nor could I see any potential of same.

--
Chuck C.
H21SE 408
--
QuoteI recently got a Nacra 5.2 on a whim (no experience sailing cats, but have owned 25ft monohulls).


If the boat in the picture is your 5.2, you may want to look for a Nacra 6.0 manual, that's not a 5.2 in the picture.

--
Ron
Nacra F18
Reservoir Sailing Assn.
Brandon, Mississippi
--
charlescarliswith plugs out to keep the hulls dry.


Use to do that too until the bees decided inside the hulls was a great spot for a nest... what a mess... but then again I was living in an area with lots of orchards.

--
John Schwartz
Ventura, CA
--
nacra55
QuoteI recently got a Nacra 5.2 on a whim (no experience sailing cats, but have owned 25ft monohulls).


If the boat in the picture is your 5.2, you may want to look for a Nacra 6.0 manual, that's not a 5.2 in the picture.

lol really? how do you know? I was sold a 5.2... the seller thought it was a 5.2... I've measured it and dimensions seem like a 5.2..
It’s hard to tell what the end of your beachwheels are. Cradles are OK, but I wouldn’t store the round hulls on an axle.
Your shoreline looks like a prime candidate for a modified Seadoo ft, or other small cantilever lift. I use an 800lb Seadoo lift for my N5.7 & H18. We use a smaller lift for the N5.0.
Remove the Seadoo bunks, attach 2x2 steel channel, with 5/4” deck boards to the channel iron. You will install these beams 90* to the original Seadoo bunks.
The 6” wide boards are adequate for the skeg boardless hulls,they are stronger than the rounded hulls that use boards. For those I would consider a 10” or even 12” wide crossmember to better take the load when someone is in the boat raising the sail while it is on the lift.
The 5.0 beams do sag a bit as we didn’t use 2x2 square channel. We just used 2 pc of galvanized steel that’s used for road signage, overlapped & secured with SS bolts
https://www.thebeachcats.…74c68a6d11e0a9953f65d591
https://www.thebeachcats.…556&g2_imageViewsIndex=1



Edited by Edchris177 on Aug 25, 2022 - 10:38 PM.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
Can anyone provide some guidance on rigging my cat ?

In the attached image the circled white cable in blue is what I *thought* is the forestay, however once I raise the mast I am short connecting to the front bridles by about 6-9 inches. The sidestays are as loose as I can make them.



https://i.imgur.com/3a9iFqn.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/viOFd0d.png

After doing some research, I can maybe use another stay adjuster to connect the jib to the front bridles, is that correct?

The previous owner sent me this picture, it seems they used the whole jib/furler assembly to as the forestay.
https://i.imgur.com/8PPr3Am.png
https://i.imgur.com/gEQX2cg.png


So is that 2 separate (but valid?) ways of rigging the cat? Either with the stay adjuster, or using the whole furler assembly?



Edited by canadian_catamaran on Aug 26, 2022 - 08:51 AM.
This is an odd ball 5.2. The jib sheets to the main beam. The lower tang on the mast should not be for the forestay, they all shackle to the same location to aid in mast rotation. I did not see the upper swivel in the pics for the furling. The swivel plus the furler would give you the length you need. Seems like a lot of shackles and carabiners in the previous owner pics. When you add a furler to a 5.2 you shorten the forestay 6". I am curious if the jib was cut from an overlap to a blade. I like the idea for clearing the tramp clutter.

--
FYC, Nacra 5.2 "Chris's Flyer"
Previously owned: Trac 14, H14, H16, H18, N5.0, G-cat 5.0
--
canadian_catamaranCan anyone provide some guidance on rigging my cat ?

In the attached image the circled white cable in blue is what I *thought* is the forestay, however once I raise the mast I am short connecting to the front bridles by about 6-9 inches. The sidestays are as loose as I can make them.



https://i.imgur.com/3a9iFqn.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/viOFd0d.png

After doing some research, I can maybe use another stay adjuster to connect the jib to the front bridles, is that correct?

The previous owner sent me this picture, it seems they used the whole jib/furler assembly to as the forestay.
https://i.imgur.com/8PPr3Am.png
https://i.imgur.com/gEQX2cg.png


So is that 2 separate (but valid?) ways of rigging the cat? Either with the stay adjuster, or using the whole furler assembly?Edited by canadian_catamaran on Aug 26, 2022 - 08:51 AM.


Very familiar with old school Nacras. I would not trust the small tang the white forestay is attached to. All three stays, forestay and two side stays, should be shackled to the large tang. On the previous owner's picture of the "clip" between the furler and the forestay bridle; I would not trust that. You should use a bow shackle there. I am stumped why they would install a small tang under there forestay tang. I use the small one for trapeze attachment. With the forestay, there should be a top swivel, jib halyard block and a furling drum. This will add the distance you are missing. I know some 5.2's had jib sheet wires running fore and aft about 6-8" inboard of the hull. Is the jib sheet attached to those or the front beam?

--
Scott

Prindle Fleet 2
TCDYC

Prindle 18-2 Mod "FrankenKitty"
Tornado Classic "Fast Furniture"
Prindle 19 "Mr. Wiggly"
Nacra 5.8 "De ja vu"
Nacra 5.0
Nacra 5.8
Tornadoes (Reg White)
--
Welcome to beachcats. What's your name?

I recommend you look at the rear starboard transom and ID the V.I.N. which will reveal the year made. Ron has a point regarding this boat and there is only so much you can tell from a picture. I'm not sure what year was the last to manufacture the 5.2 was, but your rig has newer manufactured parts. The extruded traveler on the rear beam is newer . . . (late 80's I believe), and Nacra did not change the hull lay up with the smooth white transoms until sometime in the (early?) 80's I believe. Usually you will see black inserts for the transoms, and a bolt on black traveler track on the rear beam.

I would get the standing rigging right first. The bridal to jib hardware is crap and is pieced together with parts out of the spare parts box.

Boats this old have long histories. The smaller tang could be for anything . . . I've seen them use for active jib downhauls on older rigs (before the jib furling). Hard to tell from his picture sent but he looks like he has a sheet connected to it (white with blue tracers) ending in what looks like a jamb cleat.

Nice boat and it has nice bones. You will love it once you spend a season sailing it.

--
Philip
--
Schit, I see it now, this boat was once rigged for spin. The bow spin bridle holes and the spin pole bracket on the front beam give it away. The ropes on the bridal are to hold up the spin pole. That small tang was probably used for retrievals or something McGyvered related to a spin.

Look up above the mast tang and see if there is another tang about 1/2 way up to the top of the mast, or if there are any rivot holes filled.



Edited by P.M. on Aug 26, 2022 - 11:09 AM.

--
Philip
--
Thank you all for the comments nice to have such an active group ready to help. Name is Marko and boat is a couple hours north of Ottawa Canada.

1) First thing's first, attached are a few more pictures of how the boat is stored. Currently winch is connected to the yellow rope which is doing the majority of the holding so the boat doesn't roll back into the lake. There are two supports (The blocks on the axle) and some 2x6s on both bows where it's just protecting the hulls from sitting on rocks. Anyone have any qualms about that or have any recommendations on how to make this better ? When winter comes along I'd like to pull it up further near the trees and take the load off the winch and build more of a nest for the hulls.

2) According to paperwork the seller gave me it's a 1986 Nacra 5.2. I just measured it (see pictures) and it's just shy of 17 ft loa and just shy of 8 ft wide. The serial number, tough to make out is just "SSSSSSS" or "5555555".

P.M.Schit, I see it now, this boat was once rigged for spin. The bow spin bridle holes and the spin pole bracket on the front beam give it away. The ropes on the bridal are to hold up the spin pole. That small tang was probably used for retrievals or something McGyvered related to a spin.

Look up above the mast tang and see if there is another tang about 1/2 way up to the top of the mast, or if there are any rivot holes filled.Edited by P.M. on Aug 26, 2022 - 11:09 AM.


There are 4 connection points that I see on the upper mast. From the bottom up:
1) Where what I think the forestay is connected to
2) The main cluster of connections for the trapeze and side stays.
3) 1 foot above Pulley number 1
4) 1 foot above, pulley number 2


So in one of the pictures you'll see the blue and white sail, it's got the connection point for the furler. Touch inside that sail there is wire, so plausibly it could be the forestay too. That leaves the question of what this white (what I think ) forestay could be. It is easily removable.

I also do have a bowsprit, but based on the seller's pictures that shouldn't be needed, something I can do for next season.

The red line I have holding the current forestay is just temporary, cause that's about how much travel I'm missing. It could be that it would just need a stay adjuster, but it'd have to be a pretty long one, I estimate about 6-8 inches.

Looking forward to your comments on how to get her rigged !

Thanks


Embedding pictures here is a bit difficult so here is link if the pictures are too large :
https://imgur.com/a/hXzDNd6

https://i.imgur.com/cNiG4CM.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/12eRhLB.jpg
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https://i.imgur.com/I1JsSN2.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/t0xW2Lj.jpg
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https://i.imgur.com/TJ8fOmQ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/YbVvGYn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/XbBMBof.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/6PmGrPK.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jhaOzH3.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/trkJrST.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/j2tSOBW.jpg


https://imgur.com/a/hXzDNd6



Edited by canadian_catamaran on Aug 26, 2022 - 03:48 PM.
Hot damn! Raked spreaders. I have always wanted a boat this new. Since the jib has a cable inside it your forestay is only there to keep your mast up while stored. I prefer this instead of a zipper luff.

--
FYC, Nacra 5.2 "Chris's Flyer"
Previously owned: Trac 14, H14, H16, H18, N5.0, G-cat 5.0
--
canadian_catamaran
nacra55
QuoteI recently got a Nacra 5.2 on a whim (no experience sailing cats, but have owned 25ft monohulls).


If the boat in the picture is your 5.2, you may want to look for a Nacra 6.0 manual, that's not a 5.2 in the picture.

lol really? how do you know? I was sold a 5.2... the seller thought it was a 5.2... I've measured it and dimensions seem like a 5.2..


More pictures bring more questions. Things that I thought were strange

Don't know that any 5.2's had finished sterns, only the 6.0 had them, 5.5 and 5.8 were both unfinished.
Don't think the 5.2 originally had a main traveler track that went all the way to the ends of the beam early designs, 5.2 and original 5.8 did not. 5.5 and 6.0 did.
Don't think any of the 5.2's originally had swept spreaders many were converted.
Your main beam is rigged for an over rotator but your mast has a rotation limiter which is run off the boom.
No need for an over rotator on a boom boat.
Mighty fancy downhaul for a 5.2.


On to some rigging questions.

The pic with the blue circle looks like the forestay and the jib halyard may be reversed, forestay should be above the jib halyard, that's a huge block up there. Most old school nacra jib halyards are part wire and need a wire block, not one for line but your halyard may be all line.

Also the thimble that you're trying to connect to the bridle should be connected to the hounds and the aircraft swedge should be connected to the adjuster fork that is connected to the bridle wire with a pin and ring ding not a shackle, rigged like your shrouds.

Your bridle wires may be upside down also, the aircraft swedge should be connected at the bridle tang the thimble should be connected to adjuster fork with a twist shackle if memory serves me right.

There's a start.
Ron

--
Ron
Nacra F18
Reservoir Sailing Assn.
Brandon, Mississippi
--
You have everything for furling the jib. Installing the swivel & drum will take care of 6” you are “missing” on the forestay.
Someone swapped the rear beam, what you have is better than the original.
The jib halyard was originally part wire, part line. It went from a small wire block hung on the mast, (just below the main hound), down the mast - to where you cleated it after tensioning the jib.
Once you install the roller furling, you do not use that system. The factory Nacra halyard is zippered. Goes from the jib head up to a small turning block, then back down inside the jib, (parallel to the forestay), & exits at the bottom of the jib, just above the drum.
I installed a small Clam cleat there, I just pull the desired tension, cleat, & go sailing.
I made this album years ago, it might help you.
There are many tweaks to skin that Cat, set it up what works for you.
https://www.thebeachcats.…pictures?g2_itemId=88268



Edited by Edchris177 on Aug 26, 2022 - 08:47 PM.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
Well she's starting to look like a sailboat ! Thanks all for your input.



At the place mid mast where the trapeze and stays connect there was a wire that was about 8 inches long. That's where I connected the new furling sail. I used one of the pulleys above to create myself a halyard for hoisting the protection sock.

I realize the shackle I'm using beneath the furler is not the right shackle for the job but it should be ok until I can replace it with able shackle.


Tommoorw trying for the downhaul, boom,mainsail and rudder and hopefully my first sail on the cat!



Pictures

https://imgur.com/a/Vhe3TqQ

https://imgur.com/gallery/zMxnxW5
It seems like you have a Nacra "Pocket Rocket" 5.0 with 5.2 beams and rig, looks nice. The specifications say that the 5.0 is 5.1m long, exactly as yours.

Check the stainless wire inside the furled jib, it seems to be thin, multistrand and not usable as you have arranged it. To work as forestay, you need a 19strand 4mm wire, so get a proper forestay and attach it to the furler and swivel, after that mind about the jib arrangement.



Edited by revintage on Aug 28, 2022 - 06:18 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
Hi CC,
To rig with items you have:
See if you can take the two top pressings of the bridle with the holes lining up on top of each other, set them in the slot in the lower end of the furler and put a pin through. Hopefully it works together with the old jib you have. If the multistrand wire is thick enough it could work for the time being. What thickness is it?
As Edchris pointed out, a modern jib is zippered and hoisted before each sailing session.



Edited by revintage on Aug 29, 2022 - 12:30 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
revintageHi CC,
To rig with items you have:
See if you can take the two top pressings of the bridle with the holes lining up on top of each other, set them in the slot in the lower end of the furler and put a pin through. Hopefully it works together with the old jib you have. If the multistrand wire is thick enough it could work for the time being. What thickness is it?
As Edchris pointed out, a modern jib is zippered and hoisted before each sailing session.Edited by revintage on Aug 29, 2022 - 12:30 PM.


Some concrete questions for you all:
1) The boat came with a bowsprit. Is the bowsprit perhaps necessary to rig the boat "properly"?
2) How tight should the side stays be while the boat is not in use?
3) How tight should the stays be when I want to go sailing?
4) First time owning a cat, should the mast turn almost 90 degrees while sailing? This got me in trouble one time as the spreaders got in the way of the jib switching sides during a tack.
5) Pin at the bottom of the mast that acts as a safety for the mast staying in the ball, should I leave that pin generally in or out? (currently out)


First thing's first, holy hell these catamaran's are fun!! I only had it out in a light breeze, but managed to get it up to 13 kilometers per hour. Can't wait to get it more sideways and use the trapeze.

I appreciate everyone's input. I admit I have no idea what boat I have, and seem more confused with some posts, but I hope we can get to the bottom of it with your help.

I just looked at the paperwork that came with the boat and there's a boat survey done in 2010 on the boat. It says it's a 1989 Nacra 5.2. Boat length of 17.06 feet and 8 feet width. These could be just standard measurements. The serial number is the generic "SSSSSS" I mentioned earlier.

Currently am not by the boat so can't inspect the the wire in the furler, only have pictures of how I have it rigged at the moment. The wire can be seen at the eyelet, is that enough to make a judgment call whether that wire is strong enough?

The boat came with 2 sets of bridles. 1 short and 1 long pair.

Regarding your message Lars, the real forestay I have (the white one alluded to in the previous posts) is short, and can't reach either set of bridles even when mounted on the lowest mounting point here:
https://i.imgur.com/3a9iFqn.jpeg
Mounting that forestay higher (where I've been told it should be) will make it even shorter and not allow it to reach either set of bridles.

The other jib I have looks like it would be hoistable, however can't seem to find the right forestay to hoist it on. Will take pictures of the other sails on the weekend.

The way the current furler/system is mounted is there was this piece of wire that (that was already there) that I attached the furled sail to (supported by my finger in the picture), and then see below what the bottom of the furling reaches. Using the shackles seen, everything is "just right" for forestay tightness.
https://i.imgur.com/g5zpRru.jpeg


https://i.imgur.com/5yx50Sh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ikdDgy4.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/6pgwyLT.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/I0wMXJo.jpg



Edited by canadian_catamaran on Aug 29, 2022 - 09:00 PM.
Just a couple brief points- don’t anyone hack on me, I’ve been up 36 hours & am currently on the Other Side of the World.
In the post above, 2nd from bottom photo- the boom less boAts are self rotating, that is NOT your case. See the “wishbone”, sitting just be,on your boom? You require a line from the end of that wishbone to the boom, to control mast rotation, otherwise the mast WILL over rotate. Going to weather, with mast fully rotated will not provide an smooth entry for the wind over the sail. It’s a simple short line, that will cleat somewhere on the boom. It will be at least a 2:1, dead end the line in the cleat, go through the end of the rotator, then back to the clamcleat where you will secure it. Less rotation going to weather, more when down wind. Not sure if I have a phot of it on my H18.
4th phot from the bottom - ditch the two shackles you have on the bridal wires, they serve no purpose. Simply attach the bridals directly to the U shackle on the bottom of the drum. I would replace that one with a bow shackle, they are designed specifically to hold the horizontal loads, the shackle you have is designed for vertical loads.
Regarding the mast pin- REMOVE IT after you have stepped the mast. It’s so,e purpose is to hold the mast captive, so it doesn’t jump off the ball while raising or lowering the mast.
Also, look closely at these two photos. Notice that with the pin installed, you WILL bend your DS rod if you lower the mast & forgot to keep it ROTATED 90* while lowering. Sharp eyed folks will also notice my dumbass mistake…I didn’t have the pin handy, used a 1/4” bolt, BUT, I rotated the mast the wrong way, & could not remove the bolt without lifting the mast again. In this case, end of season, I used bolt cutters…think about the orientation of the pin, & if you use something long, like a screwdriver, be careful it doesn’t rip the tramp.
Ignore the rotator in my photo, on a boom less boat it goes forward, yours will be toward the stern.
https://www.thebeachcats.…pictures?g2_itemId=76385
https://www.thebeachcats.…pictures?g2_itemId=76385
You seem to have a lot of hardware at the mainsail down haul. Some may be for adjusting sail tension while underway, & from either side of the biat. You are just starting out, endorse the KISS principle. Just use a simple block arrangement, with an “S” hook. Simply drop the S into the sail cringle, pull line to desired tension & go sailing.
https://www.thebeachcats.…ictures?g2_itemId=119565
Forget about the bowsprit, S for a spinnaker setup, leave it behind for now.
Boards- yes, they are more efficient than the skeg hulls, & volumns have been written about their use. In a nutshell, full down while going to weather, 1/2 way when reaching, up when going downwind. My advice, your not racing, yet, set them halfway & forget about them, concentrate on correctly setting your sails. Do Not, Ever, forget about them when coming to shore, or in shallows. Mark them with a piece of tape to show when they are flush with the hull bottom. If you hit something, at any speed, it’s the catamaran equivalent of the Exxon Valdez.
Find a copy of Catamaran Racing For the 90’s. I have one somewhere, (I think I lent it out). I’ll try to find it & get it to you.

Where in Ontario are you, I have a bow shackle, (along with tons of legacy Nacra parts)I can mail you.



Edited by Edchris177 on Aug 29, 2022 - 09:46 PM.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
Edchris177Just a couple brief points- don’t anyone hack on me, I’ve been up 36 hours & am currently on the Other Side of the World.
In the post above, 2nd from bottom photo- the boom less boAts are self rotating, that is NOT your case. See the “wishbone”, sitting just be,on your boom? You require a line from the end of that wishbone to the boom, to control mast rotation, otherwise the mast WILL over rotate. Going to weather, with mast fully rotated will not provide an smooth entry for the wind over the sail. It’s a simple short line, that will cleat somewhere on the boom. It will be at least a 2:1, dead end the line in the cleat, go through the end of the rotator, then back to the clamcleat where you will secure it. Less rotation going to weather, more when down wind. Not sure if I have a phot of it on my H18.
4th phot from the bottom - ditch the two shackles you have on the bridal wires, they serve no purpose. Simply attach the bridals directly to the U shackle on the bottom of the drum. I would replace that one with a bow shackle, they are designed specifically to hold the horizontal loads, the shackle you have is designed for vertical loads.
Regarding the mast pin- REMOVE IT a
fter you have stepped the mast. It’s so,e purpose is to hold the mast captive, so it doesn’t jump off the ball while raising or lowering the mast.
Also, look closely at these two photos. Notice that with the pin installed, you WILL bend your DS rod if you lower the mast & forgot to keep it ROTATED 90* while lowering. Sharp eyed folks will also notice my dumbass mistake…I didn’t have the pin handy, used a 1/4” bolt, BUT, I rotated the mast the wrong way, & could not remove the bolt without lifting the mast again. In this case, end of season, I used bolt cutters…think about the orientation of the pin, & if you use something long, like a screwdriver, be careful it doesn’t rip the tramp.
Ignore the rotator in my photo, on a boom less boat it goes forward, yours will be toward the stern.
https://www.thebeachcats.…pictures?g2_itemId=76385
https://www.thebeachcats.…pictures?g2_itemId=76385
You seem to have a lot of hardware at the mainsail down haul. Some may be for adjusting sail tension while underway, & from either side of the biat. You are just starting out, endorse the KISS principle. Just use a simple block arrangement, with an “S” hook. Simply drop the S into the sail cringle, pull line to desired tension & go sailing.
https://www.thebeachcats.…ictures?g2_itemId=119565
Where in Ontario are you, I have a bow shackle, (along with tons of legacy Nacra parts)I can mail you.Edited by Edchris177 on Aug 29, 2022 - 09:32 PM.


Thank you. I am fully embracing the KISS principle and want to keep it as simple as I can but also prevent damage to the boat

Agreed about needing to get a bow shackle for the front.

All configurations seen on the boat are as I bought it from the previous owner. Agreed the downhaul seems complex for what it is

I will make some changes this upcoming long weekend and report back. Thank you for the offer for parts, sent you a private message, located in Ottawa and coming to Toronto in a few weeks.
Hi CC,
Nice to see you are up and running!
A quick look on your latest images says you must have the mainsail tack and bolt rope in the luff groove and also have the downhaul symmetrical on both sides of the boom gooseneck. Fix this ASAP.
Have you checked the diameter of the multi strand "fore stay". No prob in light wind though so don´t worry yet.
Edchris have given you the tools for making it all work, but about the main downhaul make it 8:1 to make it trimable. About jib downhaul it must also be easy adjustable, but I can´t see how you have arranged it.
I can not see how the downhaul should be complex on your boat, except that you have attached it wrong icon_wink .
How do you check and adjust rig tension? I usually go for 100kg tension on the shrouds on the 5.5 and F18, but you can probably go a lot lower.



Edited by revintage on Aug 31, 2022 - 05:01 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
Hey all I'm back, with more questions, and maybe answers?

Main sail placed into the luff groove, thank you.

Downhaul requires more work but it was good enough for this session.

I have 2 more sails not pictured, one is another jib, with a zipper through the front edge, presumably for hoisting up over the jib. The other one is a gennaker which we can look at next season :)

In the next picture my left hand is the "real" forestay. You can see the thickness of the one rigged poking out from underneath the sail attaching to the shackle and it's smaller. So I guess we've concluded that the "real" forestay (in my hand here) is the real one, which brings us full circle to the beginning of the thread. The forestay is the thick wire with the white plastic sheathing in my left hand, but it's too short to reach the longest bridles, even when mounted at the lowest point on the mast.
Question 1, do I need a new fore stay?
https://i.imgur.com/jWP7tQ5.jpg

Bringing back an earlier picture, with the forestay mounted at the lowest attachment point (not the central cluster where the trapeze hooks up to, but that additional mounting point from earlier in the thread), I'm short by a lot. Here I connected the longest bridles and that forestay, and I was short by almost a foot.
https://i.imgur.com/O2RROdQ.jpg

"real" forestay in my hand is about the same thickness as the bridles, further indicating that the forestay in the furled sail isn't the right one.
https://i.imgur.com/wWbwj8J.jpg



Question 2Should my wishbone be mounted above the boom as opposed to below? There is nothing except the cleat at the top of the boom where I tried to mount it with the red rope, but not very well. More guidance on how to do this would be welcome. I've tried looking at a few youtube videos of people sailing the boat and noticed the wishbone was above the boom.

https://i.imgur.com/n0uBMcD.jpg



Question 3 I'm struggling a lot to get a proper tack going when I'm going from beam reach to beam reach and turning into the wind. I'm able to accomplish this in my Tanzer 7.5 much easier that in the Nacra.
I was however successful from going to close hauled to close hauled.
Any pointers on conducting a proper tack?

Question 4Should my main sail be higher up, near the top of the mast? It starts getting hella hard to hoist it up there, even when I try to point into the wind to de-power it. How far up should it go?
https://i.imgur.com/3GvTeGR.jpg



Thanks again all for your help. Having a grand time even though it may not be rigged just right!
Marko, It would be very helpful (just a suggestion) if you would create your own album and add pictures there. Then you can add the pictures in the post. Third party image hosts (imgur) don't stay around and can be a problem years later when others seek help and they are no longer there.

I can see going forward that there will be a lot of pictures yet to come.

https://www.thebeachcats.…ms/pictures-in-forum-faq

https://www.thebeachcats.…ures-in-forum-faq#Adding

Please add your signaturehttps://www.thebeachcats.…/Forums/Forum-Signatures

Here is my album which shows the downhaul and other stuff, and will answer a lot of questions just by looking at the pictures . . .
https://www.thebeachcats.…a853a56b484f22346b2e33ee

The mainsail will hook to the top of the mast and the entire sail bolt rope goes inside the mast track. You've got it wrong. I will let the others dive in and help you with the details, but most of this has been answered and discussed before and the search function is your friend.

--
Philip
--
As Philip says, looking at pictures will help you a lot and he has plenty of helpful stuff in his album. And remember Google is your friend.

1 Yes, use a decent jib and get rid of the furler and the blue jib! What condition is the zippered one in? You might also take look on the jib sheeting points as they seem very far out to the sides. Also clean up the forestay and bridle from all those shackles.

2 The mast rotator(wishbone) must be over the boom and used together with the camcleat and the stainless bracket to adjust rotation. Simple and straight forward: Attach the red line close to the clamcleat go through the bracket to a single block attached to the rotator and back the same way to the clamcleat.

At the same time you have to fix the downhaul so that you have 4 parts and two blocks on each side of the boom and get rid of the messy shackles. A simple line loop through the tack with the two joined blocks on each side is all that is needed.
http://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=127129&g2_serialNumber=4


4 The main must be hoisted to the TOP, otherwise there is not enough room between tack and boom to use the downhaul properly. When hoisting you can neither have the downhaul coupled nor the clew attached to boom.

Unfortunately your mast seem to have an ancient system where you lock the halyard at the bottom. As Philip points out you should add the common hook and ring system that all cat masts have nowadays. It shouldnt be hard to find a new top fitting´and hook from a 5.5 plus ring on ebay.

https://bnrwatersport.com/images/stories/virtuemart/product/mt119.4.jpg

As seen in your image you don´t seem to have been able to use the downhaul at all. Probably you should also add some prebend with help of the diamonds and spreaders.

Must ask, is the mast joined from two pieces just under the rotator?

Hope this helps on your way to fix up your Pocket Rocket. It absolutely has good potential.



Edited by revintage on Sep 06, 2022 - 07:46 AM.

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Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
What does the top of your mast look like?
Those legacy 5.2s used two different systems of hooking the mainsail.
Go to item 52 in the assembly manual. If you have the “fork”, about 2’ down from the top, & on the front of the mast, you MUST use a halyard with wire & ball for the top section.
I don’t know of any Nacras that used a bottom cleat for tension, unless you do not have an original Nacra mast.
The zippered jib is what the factory used, they are simple to put up.
Personally, I would never give up my jib furler, especially if you single hand the boat. I have it on all 4 Cats, even the Baby Dart.
Your Question 3 - you’ve discovered tacking from close hauled works better. Cats have long hulls, that need to be twisted through the water, they don’t tack nearly as well as pivoting a shallow hull around a centreboard. Remember, When going from beam reach, you are moving into close hauled position, then through the eye of wind. Try this - as you head up from beam reach, pull the sail in, matching sail trim to wind, (as you would if sailing close hauled). This will keep the sail driving, right up to closehauled. LEAVE THE JIB ALONE, don’t release it until it’s back winded, & pushing the bows around.
Yes, the forestay is the same diameter wire as the side stays, & both attach to the same place on upper mast hound.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
I have checked the mast top images and the fitting is the wire and ball version(same as 5.7), but with a line all the way.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
Okay, CC. If your mast is as Lars said, you MUST use a wire with swaged ball for the top portion of your mainsail halyard.
Sail goes into the luff track, the halyard goes up the track, over the two sheaves at the top, then down, ON THE FRONT OF THE MAST.
Raise the sail, until the ball gets just below the “fork” on the front of the mast. Then move the halyard in against the mast, aligned so the wire in in the fork. Release halyard, the ball is captive in the fork. Stow halyard in pocket. Tension sail via the means I showed in the photo above.
To release, undo the Down haul, pull the halyard enough to move the ball slightly down from the fork. Move the halyard outwards, so the ball won’t re- engage,then allow the sail to slide down the track.
It is a simplele & foolproof system. If you have to store & launch your boat without being able to turn it into the wind, this is vastly preferred over the hook.
My Cats are stored on modified Seadoo lifts, & can’t be turned. Even with the sail against the shrouds, it is easy to raise, or lower. Not so with the H18, & worse with the Dart.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
The fork can be seen about 50 cm down on front of the mast.

https://www.bnrwatersport.com/images/stories/virtuemart/product/mt108.2.jpg

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
Yes, good catch. It appears he is missing the front sheave, which means he cannot raise the sail properly until it’s replaced.

--
Hobie 18 Magnum
Dart 15
Mystere 6.0XL Sold Was a handful solo
Nacra 5.7
Nacra 5.0
Bombardier Invitation (Now officially DEAD)
Various other Dock cluttering WaterCrap
--
Hi Ed,
Found the image on internet, not CCs mast, just to show how the system works. To bad the sheave wasn´t there.
Checked my 5.5 rear beams and the same hook is used for setting the distance between the hulls icon_cool .
About the rope/wire halyard, do you know who makes/sells them?



Edited by revintage on Sep 07, 2022 - 12:25 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
All, thank you for the input.

Noted about the mast rotator, I think I see it now.

Album added to my profile where I'll post all the old pictures.

1) Regarding the forestay, I am still asserting that what my boat came with, the forestay is too short, unless I get what would be at least a 12" stay adjuster. I have no other parts that came with the boat. Previous owner looks like he just used the furled sail with the smaller forestay that's integrated with that. Does anyone have a measurement of the length of their forestay? (Edit I guess it's about the length of the furled sail with forestay I have).
I guess I could just get a new forestay to do this properly. Bringing this image back from an earlier post, there is this random 10 inch splice of a stay on the main cluster right above the blue circle. I put a block on it (ignore that), but maybe that was used to extend the forestay to try and reach from 2 owners ago?
https://i.imgur.com/3a9iFqn.jpeg

2) Regarding the main halyard, the boat did also not come with a wire/rope combo with a ball to hoist the main. I am also about 95% sure there is no clip at the front of the mast to clip a ball into. Here is the only picture I have of the top of the mast. There is something there, but it doesn't look like a clip for a ball. As an engineer all I care is that it's safe/doesn't break. What would be the safety/structural issue with using just a rope as I am now? I realize I am creating some extra stress into the mast by hoisting it and keeping the halyward taught down the front, but is this something I should look into replacing with the wire/ball combo?
https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=136945&g2_serialNumber=3

QuoteMust ask, is the mast joined from two pieces just under the rotator?
- I don't think so but will verify

Watched some youtube videos on tacking in cat and I think I can figure it out now. I was stalling out by turning the rudder too much. Have to let the jib back fill and power up the main in a close reach before making it through the track.

Quote What does the top of your mast look like?
Unfortunately I won't be with the boat until next weekend. I will take much more detailed pictures.



Edited by canadian_catamaran on Sep 07, 2022 - 03:52 PM.
QuoteWhat does the top of your mast look like?
Unfortunately I won't be with the boat until next weekend. I will take much more detailed pictures.


No need to, the image above is good enough. The fork is missing and you must have one. A rope halyard is to springy and is not good in combination with the mast bending due to the high sheet and downhaul tension. When the mast bends the halyard looses tension.

About the "short" forestay, it could as well be that your non original bridle wires are to short! In Australia where the 5.2 main beam is 2400mm long, the bridle wires are 3' 11 1/2".

We are all here to help you to get rid of all the homemade solutions from the previous owner.



Edited by revintage on Sep 08, 2022 - 06:37 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
We are all here to help you to get rid of all the homemade solutions from the previous owner.Edited by revintage on Sep 08, 2022 - 06:08 AM. [/quote]
The beauty of buying a used boat...

--
Scott

Prindle Fleet 2
TCDYC

Prindle 18-2 Mod "FrankenKitty"
Tornado Classic "Fast Furniture"
Prindle 19 "Mr. Wiggly"
Nacra 5.8 "De ja vu"
Nacra 5.0
Nacra 5.8
Tornadoes (Reg White)
--
So hyptothetically I'd need at least:
The hook on the mast and a way to mount it
The new halyard with ball
A simpler downhaul.
Perhaps new bridles and/or new forestay.

After some breif googling, where would be the best place to buy this?
The hook on the mast should be mounted with stainless steel rivets. There will be some load on it. Don't use the existing holes if they are routed out too much or if there is significant corrosion that would weaken the backing of the rivets.

You'll have to go to a rigger for the halyard with the ball. The ball is sometimes referred to as an aircraft fastener or nicopress ball and only a rigger will have the right kind of hydraulic roller press to get the ball on where it won't slip no matter how much downhaul pressure you have. You could cheap out and use a copper swedge instead and even do it yourself, but these have been known to slip. The boat I'm sailing now uses that method and has never slipped, but on a former boat it did and I had it replaced with the nicopress ball and it never did slip after that. Be absolutely sure you have the correct length of halyard between the ball and the thimble.

There are ways to lengthen the bridle and/or the forestay without buying new as long as you only have to lengthen them a little and you trust the existing ones. Not as good as new, but will save you a lot.

There are many ways to improve a down haul. Too many to comment on, but most important for you is to have enough purchase so it's not a physical effort to get the right tension.

--
Bill Townsend
G-Cat 5.0
Sarasota
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QuoteThe hook on the mast and a way to mount it
The new halyard with ball
A simpler downhaul.
Perhaps new bridles and/or new forestay.


1 I have one but it is farfetched to send it from Sweden, maybe Edchris have one? Hobie will probably work perfect https://www.mariner-sails…/hobie-hook-halyard.html

2 https://www.ebay.com/itm/132008635767

3 The downhaul is exactly as it should. It is the junk sitting above the blocks that is wrong, exchange it for a loop of 6mm rope.

4. I gave you the measures, check if your wires are correct.



Edited by revintage on Sep 10, 2022 - 02:41 PM.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
revintage
QuoteThe hook on the mast and a way to mount it
The new halyard with ball
A simpler downhaul.
Perhaps new bridles and/or new forestay.


1 I have one but it is farfetched to send it from Sweden, maybe Edchris have one? Hobie will probably work perfect https://www.mariner-sails…/hobie-hook-halyard.html

2 https://www.ebay.com/itm/132008635767

3 The downhaul is exactly as it should. It is the junk sitting above the blocks that is wrong, exchange it for a loop of 6mm rope.

4. I gave you the measures, check if your wires are correct.Edited by revintage on Sep 10, 2022 - 02:41 PM.




Thank you ! Will check dimensions next weekend at the boat.
icon_smile

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
Hi CC,
Did you get a spinnaker when buying the boat?

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
revintageHi CC,
Did you get a spinnaker when buying the boat?



I got a gennaker with the boat which is quite large, picture below.

Regarding the bridles the longest bridles I have are 3 foot 11 inches matching yours. The shorter pair is 3 foot 3 inches. The short set is currently mounted as thats what worked with furler sail combo as seen previously.

I found another furler with a stay extender on it of about 6 inches. Maybe I could get the real forestay to reach the long bridles with the stay extender.

The jib with the zipper to be raised over a forestay.
https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=136957&g2_serialNumber=4


The large gennaker
https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=136962&g2_serialNumber=3
canadian_catamaran
revintageHi CC,
Did you get a spinnaker when buying the boat?



I got a gennaker with the boat which is quite large, picture below.

Regarding the bridles the longest bridles I have are 3 foot 11 inches matching yours. The shorter pair is 3 foot 3 inches. The short set is currently mounted as thats what worked with furler sail combo as seen previously.

I found another furler with a stay extender on it of about 6 inches. Maybe I could get the real forestay to reach the long bridles with the stay extender.

The jib with the zipper to be raised over a forestay.
https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=136957&g2_serialNumber=4


The large gennaker
https://www.thebeachcats.com/gallery2/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=136962&g2_serialNumber=3


That looks like a furling hooter, not a spinnaker. This rig really is a frankenboat.

--
Philip
--
Nothing wrong with Frankencats, I sail one myself, but you need to be watch out for DIY solutions that harms both strength and speed.

Beware of the shorter bridle wires as they might load the chainplates to hard icon_eek . The shorter wires can load the chainplates with double the tension compared to the longer icon_eek . Would not be fun if you ripped them out......

Can calculate the actual numbers if you measure the distance between the holes in the bow chanplates.

--
Brgds
Lars

Frankentri 5.8/5.5/Inter20
Aerow trimaran foiler

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1192604934176635
--
In my case one time with shortened bridle wires the starboard front top hull plate popped loose and bow came in a couple inches. Close call. Yes beware of shortened bridle wires without any reinforcement or spreader bar.

--
Lee Lake George FL
Hobie 16 -Boomer Sails
Matrix 5.5
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