Anyone know if a P-19 can be righted SOLO with a righting pole ? Please advise ! thanks , Bill, Brooklyn NY

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Billsails
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go to www.catsailor.com then click on open forum, then general discussion, go to page 4 and click on the thread "interesting righting pole pic"
Let me know what you think.
Hope this helps

Hi Hullflyer : thanks for the referral to the pix . It looks good but .... Can It help me solo right my P-19 ? If Someone out there has used it with a cat weighing 375-400 lbs please let me know if it works & under what type of conditions?
Bill, Brooklyn NY

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Billsails
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why not simply get a righting bag?

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Andrew Scott
Mystère 5.5

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Hi : I had no sucess with a righting bag ! Bill

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Billsails
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I had planned to go into engineering when I first started college, and as a fun engineering project I designed and built a system very similar to the one in the picture. I originally used it on my H16, and I've now adapted it for my 5.7, which weighs ~360 lbs, and it still works great.

The only draw-back is that in order to get the roughly 1730 foot pounds of torque required for me to right my 5.7 (I weight ~165 lbs), the pole length has to be at least 10.5 feet. This means that the pole sticks out a little bit past the transom of the boat, which is anything but aesthetically pleasing. However, despite the lack of aesthetic appeal, people still go nuts when they see a skinny little 165 lb guy righting such a big cat solo.

Here is a picture of my righting pole:



I built mine using some aluminum shelf tubing I had in my garage and parts from Lowes. I'm not sure where you could buy a solo righting pole like this, but it is pretty easy to design and build your own, or I would be more than happy to give you the specs for the one I designed. A WORD OF CAUTION THOUGH if you design your own, carefully calculate the angles/lengths of the pole and cable, so that you minimize the loads put on your dolphin striker!

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edited by: rhuntbach, Feb 15, 2009 - 04:39 PM<!-- end editby -->

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Ryan
Orem, UT
Nacra 5.7
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Without realizing the force actually acting on the anchor point, I tried to use a sch 40 1 inch ss pipe. It bent like a hairpin. So I stepped up to sch 80 one inch carbon steel, welded a cast steel eye to attach to my anchor point. The casting broke.

Now I have the same pipe, 8 feet, with welded SS nut. It works with my 210lb... unless the waves are two feet +. I have a canvas bag too... but have not blown over since I got it. Part of my kit includes a very small sand anchor too. It keeps you into the wind and it allows you time to climb on board, catch your breath, do some house cleaning... and reattach the pole. Especially if one sails solo.




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Deepsees
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I have a 340 lb Nacra 5.5 uni and can easily right it without a bag or pole. If there is enough wind to capsize, there should be enough wind to get you back up. I am 5'10" and 180 lbs.

The boat is much more difficult to right when head to wind. You want the wind to be blowing between the mast and the bow at about 45 degrees to the hulls. The wind blows against the tramp and helps you get the sail out of the water. Once the sail comes out, the wind gets under it and the boat rights quickly. In heavier air you grab the dolphin striker to stop the boat going over the other side. As the boat rights, it should turn into the wind.

Getting the boat 45 degrees off the wind is also pretty easy. Stand on the bow and the bow moves toward the wind, stand on the stern and the bow moves away from the wind.

My apologies if you already knew all of this.

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Rich
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Deepsees, rpipper 138 & rhuntbach; thanks for all the info about a righting pole .Ripper138 I will try the 45 degrees to the wind to see if I can do it !
Deepsees I will need further clarification . "clear only if known."...i dont know so please send me a pix or two or a diagram of the pole & welded SS nut & the attachment to the crossbar . Billsails@hotmail.com
Rhuntbach : I need some diagrams or pix please. Bill

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Billsails
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First off, sorry about the long explanation... I tried to make it as concise as possible. Anyway, here are some pix:











The explanation: The bungee is used to hold the pole up while sailing. When you tip over, you swing the pole out, and clip the cable to the front beam (you'll have to figure out a way of doing this that works for your boat). The swivelling part is a regular castor (like a shelf wheel), with the pole bolted in where the wheel would normally go. The circular part that goes around the dolphin striker is a piece of tubing that was cut in half and welded (poorly, I might add ) to the castor and the sheet metal. Make sure the inside diameter of the tubing matches the outside diameter of your dolphin striker.

Finally, I'd imagine righting your P19 requires roughly the same amount of force that is needed to right my 5.7 (~1730 foot pounds); but I'd base your calculation off of 1900 foot pounds of torque, just to be safe. The formula for figuring torque is really easy--WEIGHT (in pounds) times POLE LENGTH (in feet) equals TORQUE (in foot pounds). So to find the pole length you'll need for your P19, you simply divide 1900 pounds by your weight. For example, if you weigh 190 lbs, then you will need a pole that's exactly 10 feet. (Note: I've obviously oversimplified the calculations. If you're good with calculus, specifically statics problems, I'd be more than happy to give you the formulas I used, so you can be more precise. Calculating the pole length the way I mentioned above should be sufficiently accurate, since I built in a pretty big margin for error.)

If you have any questions please feel free to ask! And sorry again for the long explanation.



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Ryan
Orem, UT
Nacra 5.7
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Rhuntbach : thanks for the beautiful pix & further explanations . I like your design & I re read your caution about supporting the pole so as not to put to much stress on the dolphin striker. I dont like the idea of putting stress on the dolphin striker .
Someone sent me pix of the pole attached with 1 ss bolt to 2 aluminum angle irons attached to the crossbar behind the dolphin striker. a SS bolt through the end of a 1.5 dia aluminum pole attaches to 2- 2" aluminum angle irons on the front cross bar. Aluminum angle irons are fastened to the crossbar by ss screws or ss rivets & the pole is held in place by the ss bolt fastened inbetween the aluminum angle irons. He uses removable SS cable attached to eye pads on the pole & a ss spring gate clip attached to the crossbar to hold the pole in the correct position , take the weight & to right the boat . I wrote to Hobie Gary & he designed & built a righting pole system that uses a pole &cables for body support & has a lever at the end of the pole that inserts into the lower daggerboard trunk. You walk/balance out to the end of the pole to right the boat . I like his method because you walk out on the pole & dont have to hang off the end of a pole to right the cat . I am not sure which method I will use . Once again thanks for all your expertize ! Bill

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Billsails
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I have one of Gary's poles that I got for my P19--it is a modified oar that has a plastic piece that slips into the centerboard well. It is very nice, but I never had a chance to use it. I sold the boat and forgot to give the pole with it, so it is just sitting around. I don't think he is making them anymore.

If you are interested, email me danberger@mindspring.com

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Dan Berger
Nofolk, VA - Hobie Fleet 32
Supercat 15
A Cat USA139

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